Heating system is useless

[IslandFalconer]

Well it cant. Thats why my comment about the valve was serious.

In a building hvac system, during the summer, the chiller runs cooling the air to a set temp, say 65f. Then for various offices, there are reheat units that reheat the air to say the 72f that is being called for from the stat. Those reheats are typically electric resistance heat but could be hot water.

I don't know how this gren system is designed. But, if its similar to a building system, the reheat on a car would be a coil the cold air would flow over, and that coil would need a valve controlling it. if that valve wasn't in the AC system, but instead on the motor, it could stick open and dump engine temp water at full flow, 200f, every time the system is activated. I do notice the rear vents suffer from low airflow, so it wouldn't take much for a heating coil to overwhelm the cool air and make it 160-180f.

Just a thought.

Vehicle HVAC systems are not like household or commercial systems. There are no coils, there are no nifty reheat systems. There’s a heater core and an evaporator. They use a blend door to deflect air over one or the other, the door sends air over the heater core or the evaporator. More likely the issue here is the stepper motors for the blend door.

 

[HereinDaRockies]

Calder stopped responding? Need to ask her what the company intends to do about the weak hvac

 

[Zimm]

I do have aN interesting tidbit…it appears that MY2026 will have a completely different HVAC system that will have heat sensors front and back in the ducts (something that apparently is absent on the current implementation) and will have front / rear temperature control.

If this is 100% confirmed (most likely since the source is very reliable) than this is proof positive for me that the current HVAC system has a serious design flaw that they’re unable to fix

Nobody in their right mind is going to change the production assembly lines at a cost of millions if there was a simple fix.

Maybe I’m seeing ghosts

It ought to backward compatible. It’s gotta fit in the same space.

 

[bails66]

Just chiming in to say have read this and other threads on this issue. An early adopter here who has seen just about all of the symptoms I have read. Last time at the dealer they did all of the bleeding stuff, and I've still had issues. The time before that they replaced the whole HVAC unit. I pushed the dealer pretty hard on their illogical explanations as to how I should operate the air conditioning. One example... they told me you have to turn A/C off when trying to get heat out of the system in Auto mode. Sure, except the moment you press the Auto button the A/C is turned on by the system. I asked them where in the owner's manual it says you should turn the A/C back off after the system turns it on in Auto mode. Of course they had no answer. In the end I felt like the head mechanic wanted to tell me what he knew but just held back. My thoughts are that the silence from INEOS on this indicates multiple faults in the design of the Climate Control and your car may have none, some or all of these faults. Best thing all of us can do is make sure your dealer is escalating the issues you are experiencing to INEOS and follow up to get their response.

 

[gkhaldi]

Update on the issue:

The dealer is still working with Ineos lvl 3 support and have been testing tons of stuff, replacing more stuff and seem to getting nowhere. We have now arrived at the point where the dealer is trying to work out a deal to replace mine with a MY2026 or replace it by a G-class (don't see the point in that but it's what they carry). They seem to have very little support from from Ineos Sales & Marketing to come up with a solution.

Looks like it's gonna end up costing me a bundle. So disappointed If anyone has any ideas who to contact at Ineos to get some movement please let me know. Thanks

 

[gkhaldi]

So an update on my heating problem:

The dealer has replaced the entire heating and cooling systems including all the valves, thermostat and sensors. They then proceeded to measure all the outputs conform the requests from lvl3 support from Ineos. The results indicate a temperature difference between the front and rear of the car of 20-30 degrees celsius depending on settings. You read that correctly...when getting 15c in the front you're getting 35-45c in the back. Under certain conditions, the temperature in the back ran up to 72,3 celsius!!!

Current response from Ineos....it falls within tolerances.

So the dealer took a brand new Ineos, identical to mine (B58 engine) and did the same test at the same time. That new vehicle showed only a 5c difference between front and back. No response anymore from Ineos now

The good thing is that the dealer has documented all the evidence with reports and videos and documentation that all of their tools were properly calibrated. Not sure what's gonna happen next.

 

[HereinDaRockies]

So an update on my heating problem:

The dealer has replaced the entire heating and cooling systems including all the valves, thermostat and sensors. They then proceeded to measure all the outputs conform the requests from lvl3 support from Ineos. The results indicate a temperature difference between the front and rear of the car of 20-30 degrees celsius depending on settings. You read that correctly...when getting 15c in the front you're getting 35-45c in the back. Under certain conditions, the temperature in the back ran up to 72,3 celsius!!!

Current response from Ineos....it falls within tolerances.

So the dealer took a brand new Ineos, identical to mine (B58 engine) and did the same test at the same time. That new vehicle showed only a 5c difference between front and back. No response anymore from Ineos now

The good thing is that the dealer has documented all the evidence with reports and videos and documentation that all of their tools were properly calibrated. Not sure what's gonna happen next.

So they haven’t replaced all components that could make a material difference for the temperature differential.

The process of elimination exercise is almost there to find the root cause.

It’s crazy how Ineos say that’s working as designed. I wonder if this hvac issue came up in the recent Calder interview

 

[gkhaldi]

So they haven’t replaced all components that could make a material difference for the temperature differential.

The process of elimination exercise is almost there to find the root cause.

It’s crazy how Ineos say that’s working as designed. I wonder if this hvac issue came up in the recent Calder interview

The only thing that has not been replaced to my knowledge is the software and computer(s).

I’m starting to suspect that the computer is registering a wrong value from the sensors. The diagram that I saw has a box with 3 valves that can be controlled and 2 temperature sensors.

The way it works (as explained by their specialists with the schematics for me to look at) is that there’s a mixing box where hot air from the engine comes in and cold air is drawn in via the chiller. Now the hot air from the engine cannot be completely shut off and there’s always a part that goes out of the box coming to the air vents in the back. They call it a mono-system that works on a temperature differential between the back and the front. They keep the front colder than the back under all circumstances. I get why but looking at the diagram and at the factual measurements that he showed me, I cannot understand why mine is behaving as it is compared to an identical other one.

Something is wrong but what and where. I’m inclined to say it’s a sensor differential that the computer can’t interpret because it’s outside parameters or it’s the computer itself.

The current approach is replaced it by a MY26 which will have the new climate control with mult-izone. The question will be who’s gonna cover which costs (just getting it on the road is 15K euro and I’m not talking about VAT but just registering the vehicle). I love the platform but I’m not gonna give them a blank check.

 

[ADVAW8S]

I'll add a interesting tid bit, interesting for me. I should state, I have yet to have an issue with my HVAC system here PNW.

Now for tid bit. My computer screen that shows the temp outside takes a while to change. It will show 65 from parking the shade that blocks the windshield for good 10 mins before jumping to 90. But the inside of the car is warmer from the exposed Safari windows. Here is what's interesting, if I have the car on auto, the A/C will blow at fan level 1. But once the screen jumps to 90 the system kicks into full gear. I have had this happen multiple times and have gone 5 mins down the road at a low level for it to jump to full blast when the screen changes. It doesn't bother me now since I run most of the temp manually to start and then switch it to auto, once I get going.

 

[gkhaldi]

I'll add a interesting tid bit, interesting for me. I should state, I have yet to have an issue with my HVAC system here PNW.

Now for tid bit. My computer screen that shows the temp outside takes a while to change. It will show 65 from parking the shade that blocks the windshield for good 10 mins before jumping to 90. But the inside of the car is warmer from the exposed Safari windows. Here is what's interesting, if I have the car on auto, the A/C will blow at fan level 1. But once the screen jumps to 90 the system kicks into full gear. I have had this happen multiple times and have gone 5 mins down the road at a low level for it to jump to full blast when the screen changes. It doesn't bother me now since I run most of the temp manually to start and then switch it to auto, once I get going.

They told me that the interior sensor is located above the o-shit bar aka passenger handle bar in front of him/her.

Here’s a test for you; park the car in the sun but cover the passenger area with a shade (windscreen or so). I’d guess you will see the same behavior.

Interesting feedback. Thanks

 

[evomind]

Hey guys,
I am assuming this happens with 2024 models as well?