Lynn Calder questions agency modell

In a recently done interview with Lynn Calder she questions the agency sales model, which is in place in some (not all) countries. This model was choosen by many manufacturers when there were more demand for cars, then it is now. More and more OEMS turn away from the agency model.

When asked what Calder would do differently with the next vehicle, the conversation quickly turns to the topic of distribution and the journey of the Grenadier to the customer. Depending on the market, Ineos currently sells its vehicles through dealers (as in Germany), direct sales via the agency model, or through a general importer.
Calder has doubts about the success of the agency model. "It was conceived at a time when high demand for vehicles made implementation much easier," says Calder.
These conditions are no longer valid. As a new manufacturer without much experience, it is evident that there are good reasons to leave sales to the dealers. Additionally, the administrative burden was underestimated, such as customer service with call centers or vehicle registration in various markets.
Calder’s conclusion is, "I am not convinced that the agency model aligns OEMs and dealers in a way that benefits the customers."

AWo

 

[Sean326]

I remember clearly in 1991 buying my first Wrangler Sahara for @$14,500, before there was a Rubicon trim, making the Sahara their top trim. I was out of college and as much as I wanted a Defender 90, it was almost double the price of the Wrangler, at @$26k. It might as well have been $90k because there was no way I could afford to pay double what I bought the Wrangler for.

I concede I may be on the “luckier” side of having problems with my Grenadier but even with the few problems I have had, I have a hard time believing that the other models @Sean326 has noted don’t have their own problems, some more significant than anything the Grenadier is having…from much more established brands. I am also on many forums from watches, to cars and lots in-between and have never had anyone more than a CS rep on the forums and that's even rare.

I do agree that as a start up INEOS has to do it better than the established brands to make it. Those brands have market share, brand recognition, customer base, established supply chains, dealer network, etc… Aside from taking care of those that took a chance on INEOS from jump, making the brand more well known has to be a priority. Interestingly, after Joe Rogan talked about it on his podcast, I had co-workers, even my boss, curious and asking me questions about my truck.

Hopefully with the recent interactions between @Tom D and Lynne, were’re closer to having a better truck and better company/customer relationship.

Jiman, We have some common background, i've always been interested in defenders and and jeeps, I still own a '09 AEV wrangler that i got for $20,000.00 then spent another $20,000.00 on it. Regarding the availability of buying a real defender they were only imported in the US from '93 to '97. If back then the defender would have been more popular and those years were extended and more were sold we may have been able to build up the nostalgic culture that much of the rest of the world has especially Britain and australia. The problem is Britain and Australia buy so few vehicles, combined about 1/9 of the USA market. Regarding other established brands having the same problems I disagree. My wife is a Lexus SUV girl, my immediate family have their favorites as well... lots (new every year or two) of BMW x-5's and x7's, and a few massarati SUv's. they can't believe that a company would be telling its owners Just wait for an update that is 6 months past original promised date and that when it does come its got to be plugged into at the dealer and not done over the air. Let alone the other reoccurring gremlins that are routinely discussed on this forum and FB owners groups. Don't get me wrong, I'm a fan, not a critic, i'm all in. I love my Gren worts and all. I've already told my dealer when the books open up on the '26 and if the promised upgrades have been made I'm trading in my new '24 for a real red, updated '26 Gren. and i just want that dealer to be in business till then and long after for the support that i'll most assuredly need. (I'm still keeping my '09 wrangler & Diesel RAM)

 

[Jiman01]

We do have lots of common ground. I think most here, if we replace Wrangler with Toyota or Land Rover, would have very similar stories before landing here

I still gotta disagree with you on the problems other brands have though A look on any brand forum will tell the tale. With that said, Lexus has been at or near the top of customer satisfaction surveys, for years but even their 550 has some interesting quirks, like the hood buffetting at speed. Seeing that driving everyday would drive me more nuts than ADAS. At least I can turn ADAS off. But either way we can agree to disagree on that one and still be friends

Regarding the over the air updates, I think at least when the pre-orders were being taken, unplugging from the dealerships was seen as a plus. I still think it is a positive. It has been an adjustment. I took for granted the ease and convenience of over-the-air updates. Back when this was first being discussed, discussions of being able to disable vehicles remotely if law enforcement requested it was a hot topic, there was talk of monthly fees for options like heated seats…all turned off/on remotely.

In light of all the government over reach that occurred during COVID, I believe for many not being connected, and having to drive to the dealership for any critical updates, was seen as a net positive. Now that a few years have past and those discussions aren’t “front page” anymore, and with fading memories of how much the government exerted control over our lives, we forget the advantages of not being connected…at least our vehicle.

At the risk of sounding more like a fanboi, I do agree with you that these updates should have come sooner and/or at least met the deadline that INEOS set for themselves. I give them slack because they're a new to the game and I assume they ran into a lot of hurdles they never knew existed….and thus an update for a non-critical fix (ADAS) was put off for higher priority tasking. I could be completely full of BS, but that's what my fanboi brain envisions

Anyway, lets wait together with bated breath for some good news ASAFP….thanks again to guys like @Stu_Barnes, @Tom, and all the others behind the scenes, trying to make it better for the rest of us.

 

[Zimm]

I respectfully disagree, there are a couple shops that take old defenders and turn em into $200,000+ works of art and move a few dozen vehicles annually.

Put on your best off the rack Ralph Lauren sport coat, and mosey on down to your local Bentley dealer and have a seat. See and feel the interior. That's craftsmanship and automobile artwork. While I hate black cars, pick a black one, and gaze into the depth of the fresh factory paint. Once it sees the light of day it'll never be the same again.

Get a close up look at a Rembrandt, and notice how he captured the emotion and light with color, and then look at a Wahola. The only thing they have in common, is someone was dumb enough to spend Rembrandt money on a social statement labeled art.

What you're calling a work of art, is a vin swapped turdbucket with assemblers laughing all the way to the bank. Sandblast a ford 9n, and wrap its spring seat in full grain, and you still have a ford 9n.

 

[Max]

and gaze into the depth of the fresh factory paint. Once it sees the light of day it'll never be the same again.

IMO you have summed yourself up here...you are a purist at heart that has seen the light of day...

 

[MrMike]

This is admittedly a small anecdotal item but I've been kind of amazed as i've browsed the forum both here and the pages on FB the lack of interactions the company has with the owners. Everything the owners discuss seems to be based on articles, rumors and dealers who say they get almost no news or feedback from Ineos HQ. I'm on other forums and pages for my other hobbies and passions, watch collecting, technical scuba diving etc. In those areas its common for the manufacturers to have a presence, check in occasionally with new products and respond when customers/owners ask questions or make comments. That concept doesn't seem to exist in this world.
Stay with me, these two concepts tie together....
I understand the historic and nostalgic roots of the Grenadier, that's partially why I bought one, I loved the defender.
But the 2000 defender sold for $14,000.00 per ai which equates to about $25,000.00 in todays $.
My grenadier (with checking several boxes) came in at $90,000.00, that's the cost of a pretty high end SUV, comparable to a Porsche cayenne, BMW X7. That said what surprised me the most was the intrusive nature of the ADAS system yet its complete lack of utility (short of a head on crash that it claims to try to prevent 2 seconds prior to collision). Essentially a system with the capabilities common to the industry in 2010 vehicles, not 2024/25. Yet i did see evidence that they were improving the system in future models from various sources such as a calif. dealers webpage mentioning blind spot monitor and adaptive cruise control. I asked my dealer also on this forum and on FB but no one had any definitive answer.
So I took a shot at asking customer service on the main corporate website. I got a pretty comprehensive response within 24 hours. I asked specifically about upgrades in the'26 model year.

CASE REFERENCE: 179818​

Hi Sean,

The new ADAS update includes the following features:

Emergency Lane Keep - active lane keeping functionality instead of merely an alert sound.

Autonomous Emergency Braking - enhancement to include pedestrians and cyclists in the existing feature.

Driver Monitoring System - an inward-facing camera designed to assess driver attentiveness.

Intelligent Speed Assist - the option to deactivate directly from the home screen.

At this time, we do not have information regarding the release date of this update, but I trust this information is helpful.

Please do not hesitate to contact us if you need any further assistance.

Thanks,

Grace

INEOS Grenadier Customer Service

We (local Grenadier owners group) have a video conference call with Lyn Clader coming up, so I guess that puts to bed any notion that they aren't contactable or willing to listen to owners.