Heater output

[Lord Ripon USA]

Those are drivability problems, and are hard to diagnose at the dealer.

Document in writing what you are experiencing, and what malfunctions you perceive, and what happens when make a change.

When you take it to the dealer, they will have to let it cold soak overnight to duplicate, what you are describing.

Don’t be alarmed, that’s pretty standard for HVAC problems.

Chances are, they will start at the beginning, making sure it’s full of fluids, and that each command from the controls is being sent by the controls.

Then they start looking at Mechanical things not working.

Drivability issues take time to decipher, that’s just the way they are because they are intermittent, and impacted by many parts.

It is very important that you can be clear to the service manager as to how these kinds of problems manifest. be very specific of your actions.

In pretty much any kind of modern HVAC system in a car, these sorts of problems can be sorted.

 

[DrahthHunter]

Hawg
I think you are on the right track with thinking it is actually an analogue overlay on a digital system. Now that weather is down to a couple of degrees C, even a drive of 35 miles does not warm up my vehicle. If it weren’t for the electric seats, it would be a real bind. I will be asking the dealer shortly.
In the meantime I was thinking of purchasing one of those cheap endoscopic tools that work with a smart phone, so I could take a look in the guts of the heating system.

I think you are on to something

I dont know the demographics of the forum, but I did notice 95% of the respondents on this issue are not north American owners, and of the north american owners seem to be very early NA deliveries, this next shipment thats in ports now may tell more, Maybe the IG has figured something out? It sounds like the squirrel cage needs a def redesign I have heard it on high and it is obnoxiously annoying, These issues are disconcerting when many of us live hours away from a dealer.

 

[Msnow22]

New report. Heat on Auto but now it sounds like there might be machine gun in the system. This morning it was clunk clunk clunk the whole time it was one. No heat on manual. I am going to contact the dealer but I feel like waiting for some more info for Ineos would be good. No sense in having the dealer chase stuff that is a larger design or mfg issue

 

[LeeroyJ]

I think this part of your post is the key: “I think the issue with all of our cars is either related to the software or electronic control panel. It looks simple with the three dials there on the dash but in reality is far from. It is a digital system with fake analogue controls.”

I picked mine up on Wednesday and drove it 1700 miles (2735kms) through 2 blizzards and a rainstorm with temps ranging from 21f (-7C) to 70f (15.5c) (Seattle Washington to Phoenix Arizona). At first i was very happy with the heater because it was very toasty. But eventually it got too hot. Tried turning down the temp control and nothing happened. Tried every combinations of settings i could think of and cannot get the heat to stop. Tried every setting with windows open and closed. No change.

The only way to make the car not be a complete sauna (but still about 90f (32c)) is to put it on auto, all the way on cold, and then it goes full blast and blows luke-cold air out of the front vents while blowing super hot air out of the footwell and rear vents (which i close). Even turning the entire hvac system off doesn't stop the heat, just reduces the air speed.

It was an absolute miserable first experience with the Grenadier. The snow and rain was too heavy to have the windows cracked, so i sat in a tshirt sweating and angry for 16 hours. The fan on full blast, together with the windnoise clocked in at 77dbs. Too loud to be able to listen to music or audio books and loud enough to drive me nuts on an extended basis.

Will call my dealer when they open again on Tuesday, but my nearest dealer is a six hour drive one way.

Back to the problem, i think the flap that is supposed to close off heat and let cold and fresh air in is not being triggered. Does anyone know where i can look to try and manually open and close it instead of relying on the fake analogue dials?

So I've been unable to drive my IG for the past 10 days because it has just been too miserable having the heat on non-stop. Eliott Bay Ineos in Seattle has been very good and gave me some trouble shooting tips but sadly none of them worked. Today Eliott Bay arranged for a truck to come pick up my IG and take it to my nearest dealer, Mossy Ineos in San Diego. Hopefully they can fix the problem.

Ironically the title for the IG arrived today as it was being loaded onto the truck (As a side note, the Hyundai Palisade that I rented to cover for the IG while its gone is a surprisingly nice vehicle.)

 

[Skydance]

So I've been unable to drive my IG for the past 10 days because it has just been too miserable having the heat on non-stop. Eliott Bay Ineos in Seattle has been very good and gave me some trouble shooting tips but sadly none of them worked. Today Eliott Bay arranged for a truck to come pick up my IG and take it to my nearest dealer, Mossy Ineos in San Diego. Hopefully they can fix the problem.

Ironically the title for the IG arrived today as it was being loaded onto the truck (As a side note, the Hyundai Palisade that I rented to cover for the IG while its gone is a surprisingly nice vehicle.)

So I've been unable to drive my IG for the past 10 days because it has just been too miserable having the heat on non-stop. Eliott Bay Ineos in Seattle has been very good and gave me some trouble shooting tips but sadly none of them worked. Today Eliott Bay arranged for a truck to come pick up my IG and take it to my nearest dealer, Mossy Ineos in San Diego. Hopefully they can fix the problem.

Ironically the title for the IG arrived today as it was being loaded onto the truck (As a side note, the Hyundai Palisade that I rented to cover for the IG while its gone is a surprisingly nice vehicle.)

I tried having the fan on full speed. Open a window. Then rotate the fan direction from each setting and wait for the actuators to move (may take a few seconds). Seems to have helped, although I definitely agree the actuators or software controlling them are a bit sticky or the software doesn’t know what to do. Do this a few times to loosen it up. Opening a window may help due to cabin pressure.

 

[LeeroyJ]

I tried having the fan on full speed. Open a window. Then rotate the fan direction from each setting and wait for the actuators to move (may take a few seconds). Seems to have helped, although I definitely agree the actuators or software controlling them are a bit sticky or the software doesn’t know what to do. Do this a few times to loosen it up. Opening a window may help due to cabin pressure.

Yeah I tried all of that. Tried every possible combination switch positions, windows opened/closed at various speeds, etc. All the functions worked, except for the ability to change the temp of the air.

 

[JOB]

An update on this post for those remotely interested. (as some semi interesting observations)

Today I returned the petrol demonstrator and been loaned an Ineos UK vehicle, which seems to differ greatly from the standard of vehicle supplied by my agent.

The car in question is a Scottish White diesel Fieldmaster, totally specced up and absolutely lovely. It has done 4k miles and is within 500 cars of mine according to the VIN.

Firstly, it was clean! I don’t just mean “washed”, presented to an excellent standard, as good as mine was when it was new. It has full front end PPF and also protective film in all of the door shuts. It has had the software update as the trip and odo are swapped over in position.

Secondly, the function of the car is a revelation compared with both our own car and the dealer’s demo. It is absolutely perfect to drive, responsive, smooth, lovely. Everything works perfectly, glitch free and just totally at odds with my experience so far. The infotainment seems faster, the HVAC actually responds to inputs as you would expect a modern car to and the whole thing just feels like a finished product.

I don’t care what they have done to this car, but if they can perform the same wizardry with ours I will be delighted.

I also think we might have the wrong colour and that the lighter hues suit the car better.

View attachment 7840151

Ten days on from my last update and not a great deal to add in terms of a resolution to our vehicle's faults. Almost 700 miles have been added to the odo of the Fieldmaster and a couple of observations. I would say that it drives and functions marginally better than our car, the steering is slightly lighter on alloys rather than steel wheels but not as light as the petrol engined car. I can only assume B57 puts slightly more weight over the front axle than B58? Software is 1946 and not some other version that I thought it might be as everything seemed so slick at first. Over the first few days, three of us drove the car and noted how well everything worked but since then there actually seems to have been a marked slow down of certain functions, more in line with our previous experience.

Switching from CarPlay to Offroad or Settings has slowed and also, most annoyingly, the HVAC is displaying similar (though nowhere near as serious) issues as our car. It can sometimes be slow to heat the cab, not really producing warm cabin air until the oil temp is around 75 degrees as my previous observations and also going ice cold for about 30 seconds upon a change of air distribution. In my opinion and experience, setting the heat to Max or near max should result in the cab becoming uncomfortably warm. No Grenadier has had the capacity to do this, 26/27 degrees and auto doesn't really get 'too hot', where in my Mercedes much over 21 on a longer drive is unbearable and Max heat is literally furnace hot.

Chatting this through yesterday with my contact at Ineos UK, one particular penny dropped for me. Last Friday was especially cold in the UK and I had cause to tow the trailer up to the North East and back. I probably had 2T behind the Grenadier and as I was with a passenger and we were chatting away I wasn't observing the fact that the climate control was set to 22 degrees and auto and the cab was toasty. A similar thing actually happened once with our car. I towed the trailer down to London and back (more like 3.2T this time) and it was one occasion I was greatful that the HVAC actually seemed to work as intended. This has made me think, is the cooling system on the Grenadier over-spec and unless the engine is really doing some work, does it not have the beef to get hot coolant in to the heater matrix? Surely this would also tie in with my 75 degree oil temp theory as well? Thoughts, opinions and observations of others might be helpful here? The man from Ineos hadn't heard the 75 degree or trailer load theories before and was going to feed back to his team.

 

[Highwayman]

Ten days on from my last update and not a great deal to add in terms of a resolution to our vehicle's faults. Almost 700 miles have been added to the odo of the Fieldmaster and a couple of observations. I would say that it drives and functions marginally better than our car, the steering is slightly lighter on alloys rather than steel wheels but not as light as the petrol engined car. I can only assume B57 puts slightly more weight over the front axle than B58? Software is 1946 and not some other version that I thought it might be as everything seemed so slick at first. Over the first few days, three of us drove the car and noted how well everything worked but since then there actually seems to have been a marked slow down of certain functions, more in line with our previous experience.

Switching from CarPlay to Offroad or Settings has slowed and also, most annoyingly, the HVAC is displaying similar (though nowhere near as serious) issues as our car. It can sometimes be slow to heat the cab, not really producing warm cabin air until the oil temp is around 75 degrees as my previous observations and also going ice cold for about 30 seconds upon a change of air distribution. In my opinion and experience, setting the heat to Max or near max should result in the cab becoming uncomfortably warm. No Grenadier has had the capacity to do this, 26/27 degrees and auto doesn't really get 'too hot', where in my Mercedes much over 21 on a longer drive is unbearable and Max heat is literally furnace hot.

Chatting this through yesterday with my contact at Ineos UK, one particular penny dropped for me. Last Friday was especially cold in the UK and I had cause to tow the trailer up to the North East and back. I probably had 2T behind the Grenadier and as I was with a passenger and we were chatting away I wasn't observing the fact that the climate control was set to 22 degrees and auto and the cab was toasty. A similar thing actually happened once with our car. I towed the trailer down to London and back (more like 3.2T this time) and it was one occasion I was greatful that the HVAC actually seemed to work as intended. This has made me think, is the cooling system on the Grenadier over-spec and unless the engine is really doing some work, does it not have the beef to get hot coolant in to the heater matrix? Surely this would also tie in with my 75 degree oil temp theory as well? Thoughts, opinions and observations of others might be helpful here? The man from Ineos hadn't heard the 75 degree or trailer load theories before and was going to feed back to his team.

Thanks for the update.

Have you checked the temp of your bottom hose to the radiator when the engine is fully warmed? Mine never gets hot, ever. Not even warm. This would support your theory.

That being said, my heater is now very hot, so it's clearly getting hot coolant from somewhere!

 

[DrahthHunter]

Ten days on from my last update and not a great deal to add in terms of a resolution to our vehicle's faults. Almost 700 miles have been added to the odo of the Fieldmaster and a couple of observations. I would say that it drives and functions marginally better than our car, the steering is slightly lighter on alloys rather than steel wheels but not as light as the petrol engined car. I can only assume B57 puts slightly more weight over the front axle than B58? Software is 1946 and not some other version that I thought it might be as everything seemed so slick at first. Over the first few days, three of us drove the car and noted how well everything worked but since then there actually seems to have been a marked slow down of certain functions, more in line with our previous experience.

Switching from CarPlay to Offroad or Settings has slowed and also, most annoyingly, the HVAC is displaying similar (though nowhere near as serious) issues as our car. It can sometimes be slow to heat the cab, not really producing warm cabin air until the oil temp is around 75 degrees as my previous observations and also going ice cold for about 30 seconds upon a change of air distribution. In my opinion and experience, setting the heat to Max or near max should result in the cab becoming uncomfortably warm. No Grenadier has had the capacity to do this, 26/27 degrees and auto doesn't really get 'too hot', where in my Mercedes much over 21 on a longer drive is unbearable and Max heat is literally furnace hot.

Chatting this through yesterday with my contact at Ineos UK, one particular penny dropped for me. Last Friday was especially cold in the UK and I had cause to tow the trailer up to the North East and back. I probably had 2T behind the Grenadier and as I was with a passenger and we were chatting away I wasn't observing the fact that the climate control was set to 22 degrees and auto and the cab was toasty. A similar thing actually happened once with our car. I towed the trailer down to London and back (more like 3.2T this time) and it was one occasion I was greatful that the HVAC actually seemed to work as intended. This has made me think, is the cooling system on the Grenadier over-spec and unless the engine is really doing some work, does it not have the beef to get hot coolant in to the heater matrix? Surely this would also tie in with my 75 degree oil temp theory as well? Thoughts, opinions and observations of others might be helpful here? The man from Ineos hadn't heard the 75 degree or trailer load theories before and was going to feed back to his team.

Interesting so you were towing and it worked well? Doesn’t the transmission cooler reside in the radiator? But the issues are not with water temp though or do we know if there are swings in water temps and the fan speeds ? I know that’s asking a lot but if your towing gonna put more heat in the radiator but still doesn’t help with the actuators and cold air if some one has a OBD 2 reader with blue tooth they can monitor the engine and water temps realtime .

 

[JOB]

Interesting so you were towing and it worked well? Doesn’t the transmission cooler reside in the radiator? But the issues are not with water temp though or do we know if there are swings in water temps and the fan speeds ? I know that’s asking a lot but if your towing gonna put more heat in the radiator but still doesn’t help with the actuators and cold air if some one has a OBD 2 reader with blue tooth they can monitor the engine and water temps realtime .

I think worked well is probably too generous a statement; produced hotter air would be more accurate.

Another observation if the white car is that it seems to run oil temp of around 100 degrees C, whereas ours usually sits around 92. What is everyone else with diesel models observing?

 

[carlg007]

Yeah I tried all of that. Tried every possible combination switch positions, windows opened/closed at various speeds, etc. All the functions worked, except for the ability to change the temp of the air.

Maybe a defective or not connected temp. sensor!

 

[Highwayman]

I think worked well is probably too generous a statement; produced hotter air would be more accurate.

Another observation if the white car is that it seems to run oil temp of around 100 degrees C, whereas ours usually sits around 92. What is everyone else with diesel models observing?

Diesel on long journey engine oil temp is circa 90

 

[Eric]

Diesel on long journey engine oil temp is circa 90

I can confirm that my engine oil when warmed up sit circa 90.

 

[rovie]

Today, for the second time, I had the phenomenon that the heater only blew hot air into the footwell. Only cold air came out of the centre and upper outlets. No matter how I adjusted the nozzles.
The reason for this is that the software does not always activate the corresponding air flaps when starting.
As I already had experience with this the first time, I can give you the following remedy:
Stop, switch off the ignition, wait until the display no longer shows anything/the computer has shut down. Restart the vehicle. The air comes out of the nozzles warm, as it should. Perfect.

 

[shiv.nandak]

I'm over here sweating every time I use the front defrost

 

[DrahthHunter]

my old F250 when I put it In 4 wheel drive the heat or ac switches to defrost supper annoying

 

[Skydance]

Yes mines like this too. A loud frequency sound (high pitch) only on max fan speed. Spoke to my dealers and they’re replacing the fan next week.

Just an update. Replacing the fan did not get rid of the high frequency pitch noise on maximum fan speed. Back to the drawing board Ineos.

 

[Eric]

Just an update. Replacing the fan did not get rid of the high frequency pitch noise on maximum fan speed. Back to the drawing board Ineos.

The fan at max has always been very noisy on all my cars. I have got into the habit of only using the first 2 settings on my heater fan.

 

[Cheshire cat]

Mine goes in next week to see if some sense can be made of the heating system. At least this cold winter has shown the inadequacies of my system as it stands.

 

[stickshifter]

Today, for the second time, I had the phenomenon that the heater only blew hot air into the footwell. Only cold air came out of the centre and upper outlets. No matter how I adjusted the nozzles.
The reason for this is that the software does not always activate the corresponding air flaps when starting.
As I already had experience with this the first time, I can give you the following remedy:
Stop, switch off the ignition, wait until the display no longer shows anything/the computer has shut down. Restart the vehicle. The air comes out of the nozzles warm, as it should. Perfect.

Is your plan to continue with this fix (pulling over, shutting off the car, waiting for the display to shut down, and then restarting), or do you expect Ineos to develop a solution that gives you a car with a fully functional HVAC system? I'm not trying to be snarky. I'm genuinely curious about your expectations for the vehicle and the company.