Stuck at Cape York

[DesertGecko]

I watched in disbelief , listening to the two of them bleating on about the treatment received from Ineos. ( watch the recording of their full trip) No manufacturer should be expected to provide warranty cover for that level of extreme use. If you want to take that level of risk, have the common sense to understand you may have to deal with the consequences!

Look.. I understand that you're from the UK. But that's what we do with 4x4 here. Some people more than others but none the less.

I've got an old school defender that's been to the cape on that track, spent nearly a year of it's life on a beach, been across the desert a dozen times. It hasn't had any mystery failures. If you sell a 4x4 as a car for the outback here that's what you've got to expect people will use it for.

 

[ADVAW8S]

Why is it their fault? Well they are the ones that can tell us. It doesn't look good if they won't explain it. If I was a grenadier owner I would be keen to find out so I know what not to do!

And personally.. in all the vehicles I've had .. I can never recall a warranty repair where they said "We're going to do a warranty repair... and we're not going to tell you why we're doing it". That's bizarre.

Can you point to me where it was stated that it was a warranty repair?

 

[MrMike]

Done. Great idea. Have a Foster’s on me.

Fosters???

 

[TheDocAUS]

The repair quote for my hydro-locked Grenadier diesel was very nearly £40k; the short block alone was a £14k list. (Call the total estimate AUD81,000). There is more detail on this thread: https://www.theineosforum.com/threads/drowning-my-grenadier-a-sorry-soggy-saga.12417641/

As for not having an engine in Australia; why would they, it should not be a common failure? That Ineos Automotive were willing to air-freight it suggests that keeping more than a narrow spares pool in Australia is considered uneconomic.

They should because there are only 3 main warehouses around the globe, Belgium, USA and Australia (servicing Asia). I think the main warehouses should have a spare motor, as they can also be damaged in "on road" accidents.

 

[TheDocAUS]

A post on FB today, take it as a grain of salt as it is facebook. I have removed the name but it wasn't any of the parties involved.

A quick follow up on yesterday’s discussion on the claim that Ineos wouldn’t support the Australian owner who completely submerged his Grenadier in the Pascoe River and ruined his engine.
As many of us suspected, the entire story was a fable. We saw the truck get submerged in another video on the same channel. We knew it was user error. The truck threw a ID 10T code! The fact that Ineos even agreed to work with the insurer was encouraging. Intentionally submerging a truck in a river is something a US automaker / insurer would laugh at, and rightly so.

After receiving a minor amount of scrutiny, the Youtube channel that started this hit-job paused commenting on the video. As of this morning, they have deleted the video and all discussion on Ineos lack of support. A friend on the inside said the YouTuber and his buddy knowingly violated the NDA. Ineos was working with the insurer on supplying a discounted engine. These two have jeopardized the whole thing

Candidates for the Darwin Award this week, those 2.

It was obvious they were being treated well by Roadside Assist, INEOS and Budget and then they do this. They must have sunstroke to be so reckless.

I immediately noticed a few of the cars went over max wading depth crossing the river. I posted back in September that was the final straw and I ordered the GrenX sealed snorkel. One pothole is enough for you to go over max wading depth, in a deep crossing.

Once I was forced into this situation, but I had a sealed snorkel on the Patrol. Now I have it again.

 

[landmannnn]

And the video has been taken down, as expected.

As someone who is on the fence on this or at least was. Regardless of who was to blame, if it was warranty, or insurance. Who paid for the recovery..

A prospective owner looks and thinks.
- Will this happen to me as the car is sold as an offroad vehicle, and I use mine as such.
- How can an engine cost SIXTYFIVE THOUSAND DOLLARS?
- How can a brand sell cars in Australia and not have one engine in the country in case of this???

I've owned my current car for coming on 21 years. If I bought a grenadier I'd want at least the same. If the parts cost is so great that an engine is 65k, HTH am I going to afford to maintain it?

I'll admit I saved the video. If I ever find myself thinking of a grenadier ever again I'll watch it again.

Why are you on this forum?

 

[DesertGecko]

Why are you on this forum?

Because I was going to buy a grenadier. If they get their stuff together It might still happen. But the chances seem to be declining recently.

 

[acky]

Because I was going to buy a grenadier. If they get their stuff together It might still happen. But the chances seem to be declining recently.

ANY vehicle that is blatantly driven into water that exceeds the manufacturers max will never be covered by a warranty, and you shouldnt expect it to.
why this stops you from considering buying a Grenadier is beyond me.
You think Toyota would warranty this? i have heard stories of a Hilux driven on a beach, cracked a rim and toyota denied warranty as it was offroad!

We do not know what Ineos communicated to Canny and co, everything thing they said in the video i suspect was click bait and your falling for it
they have hidden evidence, lied and embellished to get views.
if you use this video to come up with an excuse to not purchase a Grenadier then perhaps you should follow the Sheeple and go Toyota, just make sure you fit a immobilizer.

regarding replacement engine price, 65k, i suspect thats everything including the tow costs, a quick google tells me a B58 is 30k, a Toyota V8 is 20k from a aftermarket supplier

 

[MrMike]

Because I was going to buy a grenadier. If they get their stuff together It might still happen. But the chances seem to be declining recently.

If you actually see this video for that it is, you'll realise it's clickbait.

If this was any other brand it would have been the same. If not worse.

 

[acky]

Given me an idea... i have a youtube channel with 300k subs, been idle for years as i just dont have the time
maybe i should go buy a four wheel drive and drown it!

 

[TheDocAUS]

Not much wiggle room for a bow wave.
The Grenx snorkel , though $$, looks like cheap insurance if you are fond of deep water crossings.

If driven properly a bow wave over 800mm is OK, it will stay in front of the car, but stop or slow down then you can have a problem. Keeping the bow wave in front was part of the training I did, many years ago. Ronny Dahl is great at doing this.

GrenX offers a sealed snorkel and a sealed airbox. Safari, for example, only offers Raised AIr Intakes (not sealed snorkels). If you want a sealed Safari snorkel, the installer must do it during the installation. Safari does not do sealed airboxes for anyone.

Also GrenX's sealed snorkels are fabricated out of metal (one aluminum, the other two stainless steel) while Safari RAI's are quality plastic.

GrenX offers a sealed snorkel, sealed airbox both made of metal, this means more $$$.

 

[Blackwolf]

Just a reminder that the vehicle that failed was the only one of the ten with no RAI of any kind fitted. After watching again the river crossings I'd be amazed if it had not failed - the water level must have been well above the intake, it was certainly above the bottom of the RAIs on the vehicles in the video.

 

[Logsplitter]

Just a reminder that the vehicle that failed was the only one of the ten with no RAI of any kind fitted. After watching again the river crossings I'd be amazed if it had not failed - the water level must have been well above the intake, it was certainly above the bottom of the RAIs on the vehicles in the video.

Exactly. The instagram video filmed from behind clearly demonstrates that.

 

[TheDocAUS]

Just a reminder that the vehicle that failed was the only one of the ten with no RAI of any kind fitted. After watching again the river crossings I'd be amazed if it had not failed - the water level must have been well above the intake, it was certainly above the bottom of the RAIs on the vehicles in the video.

True and the RAI probably gave that little bit more protection, than no RAI.

It is easier for the water to get in with no RAI, even if the RAI is not sealed.

An expert on these matters made that exact observation to me today.

 

[acky]

If driven properly a bow wave over 800mm is OK, it will stay in front of the car, but stop or slow down then you can have a problem. Keeping the bow wave in front was part of the training I did, many years ago. Ronny Dahl is great at doing this.

Agreed, however having done that crossing its extremely rough, and theres a big flow of water hitting the side of the vehicle, you cannot build and maintain a speed to create the bow wave.
you have to crawl it, i assume they walked it first, i would not have tried at that depth!

 

[Rok_Dr]

Fosters???

I don’t think the rest of the world realises that fosters hasn’t been sold in Australia for decades

 

[Tazzieman]

Agreed, however having done that crossing its extremely rough, and theres a big flow of water hitting the side of the vehicle, you cannot build and maintain a speed to create the bow wave.
you have to crawl it, i assume they walked it first, i would not have tried at that depth!View attachment 7914864

Zoom in. Something's being roughly measured here!

 

[Braydo]

Look.. I understand that you're from the UK. But that's what we do with 4x4 here. Some people more than others but none the less.

I've got an old school defender that's been to the cape on that track, spent nearly a year of it's life on a beach, been across the desert a dozen times. It hasn't had any mystery failures. If you sell a 4x4 as a car for the outback here that's what you've got to expect people will use it for.

Sure, but we don't do deep water crossings without a snorkel. What car on sale in Australia (including your old school defender) would cross water that far above its wading depth without a snorkel. We're hard on our equipment here, yes, but this is not that.

 

[NQ94]

They should because there are only 3 main warehouses around the globe, Belgium, USA and Australia (servicing Asia). I think the main warehouses should have a spare motor, as they can also be damaged in "on road" accidents.

I can see why they don't store a complete engine assembly. It could be used within a few months with no problems or it can sit there for years and may have issues. Car engine are generally made just in time ready to be fitted and started quickly. Engines in long term storage need to be treated internally for corrosion with preserving oil etc every now and then so that they retain warranty and do not have issues when used. An engine in long term storage and not maintained can have issues with rings, turbo and valves. A long block with no accessories is easy because there are openings to make it easy to inspect and treat. A fully assembled engine is more difficult because there is an assembled fuel system, turbo, and cooling system to maintain in storage.

 

[Tazzieman]

A "new old stock" engine is not desirable!
All the rubber bits age too.