INEOS will NOT protect order holders in the US from dealer markups

[CLE216]

INEOS has no choice. US dealer franchise laws, state by state, are written to protect the financial interests of dealers. Period. If INEOS tries something else, they are subject to long and costly lawsuits. It is unrealistic to expect anything different for a new, small player in the US auto market.

I just keep thinking of how Saturn bucked the system. Does anyone know how Saturn was able to circumvent the typical dealer model back in the day? If that could be done then, why not now?

 

[YellowLab]

I just keep thinking of how Saturn bucked the system. Does anyone know how Saturn was able to circumvent the typical dealer model back in the day? If that could be done then, why not now?

Or Tesla for that matter

 

[ADVAW8S]

Tesla bucked the dealer model because dealer model was written before electric cars. They found a loophole. Saturn was an offshoot of GM and was built to compete against Japanese cars. Some say they closed down because GM dealerships were not happy with the Saturn dealership model. And since Saturn was the little brother, they decided to shut them down.

 

[FlyersFan76]

I just keep thinking of how Saturn bucked the system. Does anyone know how Saturn was able to circumvent the typical dealer model back in the day? If that could be done then, why not now?

I believe part of the issue is some states have laws prohibiting manufacturers from selling direct to consumers.

While I am a fan of a distribution sales model at least Tesla employs salespeople and maintenance people and a building. Not just a web page and a tow truck driver to deliver your Rivian or similar. EDIT: They are not in my area so I know nothing of Rivian's dealer network. I am sure their goals are similar to Tesla's roll out.

And it isn't just auto manufacturers. Oil companies can't sell gasoline direct to consumers in many states. They do not own gas stations just the brands that individuals/small companies/etc sell.

 

[D90ca]

The small volume limit is 5,000 or less per calendar year. It isn't automatic. A manufacturer has to apply to be covered on an alternative standard. Over 5,000 and the entire line would have to meet CAFE averages, and since the IG would be far below that standard, they'd pay thousands in penalties for every one sold.

Until they get a hydrogen and/or electric model, sales in the U.S. will be limited, which makes the dealer expansion rollout difficult. So I don't expect expanded service centers any time soon.

Has anyone from Ineos confirmed that there are US production limits they are following?

 

[anand]

Has anyone from Ineos confirmed that there are US production limits they are following?

It has been mentioned, but not specifically confirmed. From the members of the forum that responded to the form I posted elsewhere, we have pre-order numbers ranging between 9389 and 13986 currently slated for Q4 2023 production

 

[Lemon35]

It has been mentioned, but not specifically confirmed. From the members of the forum that responded to the form I posted elsewhere, we have pre-order numbers ranging between 9389 and 13986 currently slated for Q4 2023 production

Catching up on posts here and "ooo that's me!"

There are a few 93## even lower but not many, perhaps 40 lower in the US batch. If Ineos is capacity limited to 5000 units per year for CAFE standards, this is consistent with the Q4 projected builds.