Heating system is useless

[Zimm]

Correlation is not causation, especially if you are aided by knowledge of how the heating system works. There isn’t some bifurcation of heat source amongst the vents.

We should stop spreading this gospel. Process of elimination is highly useful here.. if you have blistering hot air somewhere in the hvac system, then it’s not an “air in the system” issue.

Sending owners down wild goose chase is zero value

But you do have re circulation and makeup air with and an automated system, that, we don't have an actual mechanical control over. The system has to take into account outside air temps, and interior temps to maintain a setting, and it may just do that with flow rates, or it may do that by mixing in the refesh air or recirculating as it sees fit. No, I really don't have a clue as to how the system works because I don't have any schematics, but in turn, not knowing the details, (which I may add no one here seems to know) I cannot dismiss anyone's anecdotal experience or judge it to be true or not.

 

[IslandFalconer]

But you do have re circulation and makeup air with and an automated system, that, we don't have an actual mechanical control over. The system has to take into account outside air temps, and interior temps to maintain a setting, and it may just do that with flow rates, or it may do that by mixing in the refesh air or recirculating as it sees fit. No, I really don't have a clue as to how the system works because I don't have any schematics, but in turn, not knowing the details, (which I may add no one here seems to know) I cannot dismiss anyone's anecdotal experience or judge it to be true or not.

Ineos didn’t te invent the heater. You would have to have multiple cores to cause different heat out of different vents. There are only one in and one out heater tubes. So there is only one heater core. If it’s blowing hot out of all the vents in any position, but then only like warm in position one, there is no amount of bleeding air that will change the physical temperature of the actual heater core. It’s just a radiator. These anecdotal I bled the system and it’s fixed is nearly impossible.

 

[CRH]

Ineos didn’t te invent the heater. You would have to have multiple cores to cause different heat out of different vents. There are only one in and one out heater tubes. So there is only one heater core. If it’s blowing hot out of all the vents in any position, but then only like warm in position one, there is no amount of bleeding air that will change the physical temperature of the actual heater core. It’s just a radiator. These anecdotal I bled the system and it’s fixed is nearly impossible.

Believe what you want to, my thoughts were the same as yours, how can bleeding the system stop cold air from some vents and hot from others. What I can tell you as a Grenadier owner, i can take a picture with today's paper if you need evidence, bleeding the system fixed mine. It wasn't just 1 go and they fixed it, I took it back a few times, but it did fix the issue.
If you don't want to believe me, that's up to you but don't discourage others from having their system from having a bleed a few times.

 

[IslandFalconer]

Believe what you want to, my thoughts were the same as yours, how can bleeding the system stop cold air from some vents and hot from others. What I can tell you as a Grenadier owner, i can take a picture with today's paper if you need evidence, bleeding the system fixed mine. It wasn't just 1 go and they fixed it, I took it back a few times, but it did fix the issue.
If you don't want to believe me, that's up to you but don't discourage others from having their system from having a bleed a few times.

Unless that procedure some how re calibrates the blend doors it doesn’t make any sense.

 

[Zimm]

Ineos didn’t te invent the heater. You would have to have multiple cores to cause different heat out of different vents. There are only one in and one out heater tubes. So there is only one heater core. If it’s blowing hot out of all the vents in any position, but then only like warm in position one, there is no amount of bleeding air that will change the physical temperature of the actual heater core. It’s just a radiator. These anecdotal I bled the system and it’s fixed is nearly impossible.

It is LIKELY that simple as they didn't offer independent zones and I'm inclined to agree... but...

I don;t know where the thermocouples are.
I don't know how the ductwork is routed.
I don't know if its a split core. (or two cores in series due to a lack of space)
I don't know if coolant flow is controlled for the temperature.

What do I know?

I do know multiple people have reported a solution with bleeding. Could the cases be coincidence? Sure. The claimed solution seemed odd to me. But being that no one outside of Ineos, the maker that chooses to approach this issue with bleeding, can say anything else factual about this system, "I see two hoses" really tells me nothing. Until I see the schematics, I can't say they are incorrect. All they are doing is relaying their experience.

 

[Zimm]

Unless that procedure some how re calibrates the blend doors it doesn’t make any sense.

If a core is 1/2 air, all the air flowing over the core will not be heated and if the ductwork somehow splits the air so a set of vents ends up with the cool air, it seems possible to be hot down below and lukewarm above.

 

[CRH]

Unless that procedure some how re calibrates the blend doors it doesn’t make any sense.

It sounded ridiculous to me, to the degree that I thought i may have to sell, but somehow it does work. Makes no sense, but we have no idea how it really works

 

[IslandFalconer]

This is the best pic I could get from a dealership

 

[Skydance]

Ineos didnt reinvent the heating. My old car did this just fine, I agree. It’s just that the heating and all the blend doors are now activated by software which is very dumb and slow. Software which boots up the whole car before you even start it. Software that doesn’t shut down after you pulled the key but I guess it’s how modern cars are now.

After doing the bleed and making sure both coolant reservoirs are topped up to max on a cold engine. I would also do one more step. Hit mute button for 30 seconds. This should reset everything and recalibrate the heating. It definitely works for me.

Then I leave it permanently on face and feet and fan 1 because auto makes the face and feet whistle now and again. It’s the software and calibration/reset at fault too.

By the way, I had a new heater core changed too and made no difference whatsoever.

 

[IslandFalconer]

Ineos didnt reinvent the heating. My old car did this just fine, I agree. It’s just that the heating and all the blend doors are now activated by software which is very dumb and slow. Software which boots up the whole car before you even start it. Software that doesn’t shut down after you pulled the key but I guess it’s how modern cars are now.

After doing the bleed and making sure both coolant reservoirs are topped up to max on a cold engine. I would also do one more step. Hit mute button for 30 seconds. This should reset everything and recalibrate the heating. It definitely works for me.

Then I leave it permanently on face and feet and fan 1 because auto makes the face and feet whistle now and again. It’s the software and calibration/reset at fault too.

By the way, I had a new heater core changed too and made no difference whatsoever.

I have a new core, it’s hot everywhere except for face only where it’s warm. It’s exactly the same as my first heater core, and exactly the same in the 2023 loaner I had.

 

[IslandFalconer]

Ineos didnt reinvent the heating. My old car did this just fine, I agree. It’s just that the heating and all the blend doors are now activated by software which is very dumb and slow. Software which boots up the whole car before you even start it. Software that doesn’t shut down after you pulled the key but I guess it’s how modern cars are now.

After doing the bleed and making sure both coolant reservoirs are topped up to max on a cold engine. I would also do one more step. Hit mute button for 30 seconds. This should reset everything and recalibrate the heating. It definitely works for me.

Then I leave it permanently on face and feet and fan 1 because auto makes the face and feet whistle now and again. It’s the software and calibration/reset at fault too.

By the way, I had a new heater core changed too and made no difference whatsoever.

Can you take a digital thermometer set your temperature output to max, put it on face, fan level 2 and measure center vent output temp vs left and right outer vents.

 

[1tgreene]

If a core is 1/2 air, all the air flowing over the core will not be heated and if the ductwork somehow splits the air so a set of vents ends up with the cool air, it seems possible to be hot down below and lukewarm above.

Is this a possible explanaton of cold air onto the windshield and warm from the face vents in auto mode?

 

[Baron von Teuchter]

Interestingly mine had coolant replaced and bled properly by the dealer recently and since then the heating has been ferocious again. Ridiculously so. Great for winter and in summer I’m quite happy to have windows down

Oddly, the AC is a little noisy and not working as well as it was. In trying to isolate what was making the noise I turned the AC off whilst driving - 2 seconds later the noise went away and the air got colder

 

[gkhaldi]

So mine has an enormous problem with heating. It’s one of the first builds and it’s been several times in for fixing at the dealership. In the last 24 months, it sat at the dealer for 9 months and they replaced the aircon, the heater box, the flaps, a couple of controllers units units, the aircon nebulizer in front of the bulkhead They spend a gigantic amount of time and parts and still nothing. They bled the system over 15 times and have level 2 and 3 support from Ineos on it for months.

After all this it still gives extremely heat at the back where my kids are seated (temps up to 80 Celsius!) and cold in the front. Doesn’t matter if it’s on auto, manual or different positions and fan speed.

Now in discussion about replacing the car because it’s unusable for travel like this. I only did 2 major trips (17K kms) on it and luckily it’s not my daily.

I knew going into this car that it would have some issues but 21 months on a problem that’s a safety issue (high Atlas Mountains in march , -10c outside and 5c inside after a couple of hours) is way beyond reasonable.

Anyone else out there in a same situation? If so, don’t hesitate to PM me please. The more cases I can find …the more chance I have to get a new car (we’ll sort of…won’t be free but I would like Ineos to bear the brunt of it). And no, I’m not switching brand nor do I want a refund. Mechanically…it’s a beast and I love it.

 

[Zimm]

It’s probably a 20 dollar valve on the engine or something. :/

 

[SilverNZ]

So mine has an enormous problem with heating. It’s one of the first builds and it’s been several times in for fixing at the dealership. In the last 24 months, it sat at the dealer for 9 months and they replaced the aircon, the heater box, the flaps, a couple of controllers units units, the aircon nebulizer in front of the bulkhead They spend a gigantic amount of time and parts and still nothing. They bled the system over 15 times and have level 2 and 3 support from Ineos on it for months.

After all this it still gives extremely heat at the back where my kids are seated (temps up to 80 Celsius!) and cold in the front. Doesn’t matter if it’s on auto, manual or different positions and fan speed.

Now in discussion about replacing the car because it’s unusable for travel like this. I only did 2 major trips (17K kms) on it and luckily it’s not my daily.

I knew going into this car that it would have some issues but 21 months on a problem that’s a safety issue (high Atlas Mountains in march , -10c outside and 5c inside after a couple of hours) is way beyond reasonable.

Anyone else out there in a same situation? If so, don’t hesitate to PM me please. The more cases I can find …the more chance I have to get a new car (we’ll sort of…won’t be free but I would like Ineos to bear the brunt of it). And no, I’m not switching brand nor do I want a refund. Mechanically…it’s a beast and I love it.

I too suffer this problem but luckily our climate is more benign (low of -3c in winter). If I fiddle with the dials enough (it's very inconsistent), I can get very hot air out of the rear vents but alas, still cold air out of the front vents . Luckily I have the heated front seats otherwise it would be near unbearable. However, like you I absolutely love my Grenadier and would never consider any other vehicle now. After decades in old Defenders I just tell myself to harden up and put gloves and a coat on.

Interestingly, when the car was new (January 2024 to me, so probably an August 2023 build) I don't remember having this problem. It went in for a service about a year ago and the mechanic proudly said that he had upgraded the heating system due to a technical bulletin...I didn't notice anything at the time because it was late Autumn and the weather was not too hot/cold. I suspect this is about when my problems started.

It's going in next month for the door handle recall. I will get them to look at it again but given everyone else's problems I don't hold out much hope. It's a pity things like this spoil an otherwise excellent vehicle.