Grenadier build slot DELAY thread

[OGrid]

Seems odd the we in the UK/Row are getting production vehicles but testing is still going on in the US. Maybe later production will see some revisions/enhancements.

Yes, I’m with you 100% on this.

Nothing like sorting some high temp and altitude bugs out…oh, hang on. Everywhere is high temp now…

 

[Tazzieman]

Yes, I’m with you 100% on this.

Nothing like sorting some high temp and altitude bugs out…oh, hang on. Everywhere is high temp now…

Not Tasmania Best 4 season climate in the world now.

 

[Arkaig]

Maybe it's more to do with the introduction and pricing of the double cab pick-up.

 

[Caladan]

Got this via email this morning here in the US

PRICING AND ORDERING

We recently took the decision to change when we’ll release finalized pricing and ordering dates. Now you’ll receive that information early in 2023, rather than near the end of 2022. The reason? We want to be 100% certain on all pricing and lock them down before we let you know. Don’t worry, production schedules for North America remain unchanged. We plan to begin deliveries to customers later in 2023.

I can understand why INEOS has delayed releasing pricing info until early 2023. If you track auto industry pricing reports on Blackbook or Cox Automotive, the US wholesale used auto market has just witnessed its sixth week of steadily declining prices. The largest price percentage drop has been in the “Large/Luxury SUV” segment. This means that US dealers are facing problems with customers who know that dealers are becoming “upside-down” (bought high at auction but the cars are now losing value). Historically, it takes 4-6 weeks for wholesale pricing drops to drive down retail used auto prices. And when that happens, used car pricing always impacts the new car market because dealers realize customers have greater choice in the overall market. I’m willing to bet that INEOS is tracking the US auto market pricing and is also seeing this downward trend towards a major pricing correction. INEOS wants to be competitive against Jeep Wrangler and Ford Bronco in the US and will be looking to see if Ford and Jeep make any downward car pricing adjustments for Manufacturing Year 2023 (MY23) and/or roll-out new financial incentives. INEOS has a little time to play with in the US and wants to get pricing right. As a new company entering a major market, I think delaying US pricing announcements until early 2023 is a smart decision for INEOS.

 

[DaveB]

If Ineos are not selling direct to the owner in the US but via the more traditional dealer model, then they'd still have an opportunity to adjust final retail prices downwards from the recommended retail price. Less so in the opposite direction.

If you can't fix a price this year, it can only mean one thing.

Dealers will set their prices based on demand and availability. That is what is happening all over the industry world wide. I assume dealers in the US will have to buy stock so they will take up build slots and make them even harder to get. Ineos also have the following on their website
The manufacturing build slot is indicative only and will be confirmed upon your order confirmation. We may need to make adjustments to our production programme to take into account supply shortages of certain raw materials and components which may impact delivery dates.

 

[Tazzieman]

Dealers will set their prices based on demand and availability. That is what is happening all over the industry world wide.

Ineos aren't the only company with an agency model.
Though it will be interesting to see how this plays out. Will the stealerships win?

Dealers sue Mercedes-Benz for $650 Million in Goodwill Destruction Damages — Auto Expert John Cadogan

Eight out of 10 dealers are suing Mercedes Australia, saying the fixed price agency model is an ethical, consumer violation. This could set a new legal precedent for retailers…

autoexpert.com.au

 

[DaveB]

Ineos aren't the only company with an agency model.
Though it will be interesting to see how this plays out. Will the stealerships win?

Dealers sue Mercedes-Benz for $650 Million in Goodwill Destruction Damages — Auto Expert John Cadogan

Eight out of 10 dealers are suing Mercedes Australia, saying the fixed price agency model is an ethical, consumer violation. This could set a new legal precedent for retailers…

autoexpert.com.au

Yes Mercedes and Honda in Australia and others on the way.

 

[Halliwell Jones Chester]

Most/all car manufacturers have new pricing for each calendar year. So far we have Ineos 2022 pricing. I have always assumed they will bring out different pricing in 2023. Only thing you can guarantee is they won't have any end of year specials as many car companies do to clear stock before they roll into a new model year. Pre COVID that was. For those people who have a late 2022 build date your car will already be one year older than a January 2023 built Grenadier

Hi @DaveB If you are based in the UK I really wouldn't worry what year the car was built as the only way a car is valued here is Miles, condition, spec and reg.

Even the reg isn't huge now with us having two plate changes a year. This model year may come in, in different countries but here in the UK it's not something that has any relevance to the price of your part exchange unless there has been big standard spec changes or a facelift done.

Steve.

 

[DaveB]

Hi @DaveB If you are based in the UK I really wouldn't worry what year the car was built as the only way a car is valued here is Miles, condition, spec and reg.

Even the reg isn't huge now with us having two plate changes a year. This model year may come in, in different countries but here in the UK it's not something that has any relevance to the price of your part exchange unless there has been big standard spec changes or a facelift done.

Steve.

In Australia we have these things called Gray Nomads. They retire, buy a large, diesel, 4WD and a huge caravan. They then spend years driving around Australia. It takes years A vehicle built in 2022 is a year older than a vehicle built in 2023. Even if it is December to January. They are typically advertised as Model year and first registered. So it might be model year 2022, first registered February 2023.

 

[Halliwell Jones Chester]

In Australia we have these things called Gray Nomads. They retire, buy a large, diesel, 4WD and a huge caravan. They then spend years driving around Australia. It takes years A vehicle built in 2022 is a year older than a vehicle built in 2023. Even if it is December to January. They are typically advertised as Model year and first registered. So it might be model year 2022, first registered February 2023.

How many plate changes per year do you have?

 

[emax]

What is a 'plate change' in this context ?

 

[DaveB]

How many plate changes per year do you have?

The VIN plate has the build month and year on it and that is permanent as usual. We only have one registration plate and that lasts forever unless you change to personalised plates or move to a different state.

 

[MRO]

They are more motivated than we are to get vehicles in our hands that they are confident in. I am happy to wait until they want to give me the keys to something they will put their name to. The first few months of delivered vehicles will define their brand and also the residuals of what we put our money into.

I am a little desperate as I need to replace current vehicles but there is nothing else on the market that will do this job so I will wait if I have to.

 

[Halliwell Jones Chester]

What is a 'plate change' in this context ?

Plate changes in the UK @emax determines the "age" of your car. New plates come out 1st March and 1st September. In essence we could have two cars in our showroom, one built in 21 and the other in 22. If the one built in 22 is bought and registered in February and the one built in 21 is bought and registered in March and they are identical for arguements sake then the older car but with the latest number plate would be worth more money.

I hope that's what you were asking otherwise I might have sounded a little patronising, apologies if I got it wrong.

Steve.

 

[emax]

No, good explananation, thank you. But I think you do not mean the entire number plate but only a part of it? A stamp or a sticker from an authority?

 

[DaveB]

Plate changes in the UK @emax determines the "age" of your car. New plates come out 1st March and 1st September. In essence we could have two cars in our showroom, one built in 21 and the other in 22. If the one built in 22 is bought and registered in February and the one built in 21 is bought and registered in March and they are identical for arguements sake then the older car but with the latest number plate would be worth more money.

I hope that's what you were asking otherwise I might have sounded a little patronising, apologies if I got it wrong.

Steve.

Wow. That sounds like an expensive waste of time and money.

 

[Halliwell Jones Chester]

No, good explananation, thank you. But I think you do not mean the entire number plate but only a part of it? A stamp or a sticker from an authority?

UK plates have some defining characters, the first two letters show where in the country it was registered, so Chester would be DA, DC, DF, DG, DK and so forth. The next two items are numbers which tell you the year of the car so March registration onwards this year could start like DF22 region then year. September starts DF72 then the last three are completely random and will always be letters DF22 HRR.

Steve.

 

[DaveB]

UK plates have some defining characters, the first two letters show where in the country it was registered, so Chester would be DA, DC, DF, DG, DK and so forth. The next two items are numbers which tell you the year of the car so March registration onwards this year could start like DF22 region then year. September starts DF72 then the last three are completely random and will always be letters DF22 HRR.

Steve.

Why would that information need to be on the plates for everyone to see?
Who needs to know that?

 

[Halliwell Jones Chester]

Why would that information need to be on the plates for everyone to see?
Who needs to know that?

Never really thought that much into it to be honest, region and year. The two plate changes each year boost economy apparently with people wanting the new plate which is a "thing" here in the UK.

It also helps authorities know where the car was registered.

Steve.

 

[emax]

UK plates have some defining characters, the first two letters show where in the country it was registered, so Chester would be DA, DC, DF, DG, DK and so forth. The next two items are numbers which tell you the year of the car so March registration onwards this year could start like DF22 region then year. September starts DF72 then the last three are completely random and will always be letters DF22 HRR.

Steve.

We have partially sth. similar in Germany.

The first letter group (up to three characters) is the City or district: 'B' is Berlin, 'K' is Köln (Colgone), and 'DI', is 'Dieburg' which is my district.
The next letter group (up to two characters) is random, and then there is a random number from 1 to 9999.


My car has "DI-EH 1207'. And I have been having this plate now since 22 years ...
No need for a new plate twice a year ...
(Only the 'TÜEV' (MOT in UK) sticker is renewed every two years).


BTW: My Diesel motorbike has 'DI-SL 15' which reads like 'DIeSeL, and '15' was the year when I bought it: 2015. ;-) I payed 12 € extra for this 'personalized' plate.