Grenadier Vs Defender 110 (+25yo) In the US

[Jeremy996]

I have run old Defenders for 300,000 miles ish, (1989 LR110CSW and a 1990 LR90). When I got the Grenadier, my wife was worried I would keep the LR90 as a pet, https://www.theineosforum.com/classifieds/1991-land-rover-90-van-with-windows-diesel-2-5na.6/, but in the end, the decision to let it go was all too easy. The most relevant phrase is "old"; it's slow, loud, cramped, maintenance intensive, compromised in its design and rather spartan. (If I want spartan, I have a Morgan 1600 4/4, the "minimum acceptable sports car"; if you take something off it makes it worse, adding stuff does not always make it better).

Although later pre 2016 Defenders had more toys and soundproofing, it was compromised by the hard points of the vehicle, so a/c and electrical toys were a bit of a lash-up, it is a bit small for modern adults and there are legion build issues tied into the seal designs and waterproofing. You look under a old Defender and it seems a little dainty; you look under a Grenadier and it looks like a Mercedes truck.

It must be fashion and rarity that drives old Defender prices in the USA; there's no way I'd spend more than £35k, (the list price of a LR110CSW in the specification I wanted in 2010).

 

[Cheshire cat]

I have run old Defenders for 300,000 miles ish, (1989 LR110CSW and a 1990 LR90). When I got the Grenadier, my wife was worried I would keep the LR90 as a pet, https://www.theineosforum.com/classifieds/1991-land-rover-90-van-with-windows-diesel-2-5na.6/, but in the end, the decision to let it go was all too easy. The most relevant phrase is "old"; it's slow, loud, cramped, maintenance intensive, compromised in its design and rather spartan. (If I want spartan, I have a Morgan 1600 4/4, the "minimum acceptable sports car"; if you take something off it makes it worse, adding stuff does not always make it better).

Although later pre 2016 Defenders had more toys and soundproofing, it was compromised by the hard points of the vehicle, so a/c and electrical toys were a bit of a lash-up, it is a bit small for modern adults and there are legion build issues tied into the seal designs and waterproofing. You look under a old Defender and it seems a little dainty; you look under a Grenadier and it looks like a Mercedes truck.

It must be fashion and rarity that drives old Defender prices in the USA; there's no way I'd spend more than £35k, (the list price of a LR110CSW in the specification I wanted in 2010).

Agree 100%
My Td5 will be on the market soon.

 

[stickshifter]

I have run old Defenders for 300,000 miles ish, (1989 LR110CSW and a 1990 LR90). When I got the Grenadier, my wife was worried I would keep the LR90 as a pet, https://www.theineosforum.com/classifieds/1991-land-rover-90-van-with-windows-diesel-2-5na.6/, but in the end, the decision to let it go was all too easy. The most relevant phrase is "old"; it's slow, loud, cramped, maintenance intensive, compromised in its design and rather spartan. (If I want spartan, I have a Morgan 1600 4/4, the "minimum acceptable sports car"; if you take something off it makes it worse, adding stuff does not always make it better).

Although later pre 2016 Defenders had more toys and soundproofing, it was compromised by the hard points of the vehicle, so a/c and electrical toys were a bit of a lash-up, it is a bit small for modern adults and there are legion build issues tied into the seal designs and waterproofing. You look under a old Defender and it seems a little dainty; you look under a Grenadier and it looks like a Mercedes truck.

It must be fashion and rarity that drives old Defender prices in the USA; there's no way I'd spend more than £35k, (the list price of a LR110CSW in the specification I wanted in 2010).

Defenders were never cheap here, even when new they were priced much higher than in the UK.

My impression: Americans don't realize that the Defender was a working man's truck in the UK, and a farmer's truck, as well as a rich man's hunting vehicle. In the UK, the Defender really spanned all classes. Folks in the UK don't realize that here in the US, the Defender was never in reach for the working class.

The last year they were sold here was 1997. The insane price for these old vehicles is driven by rarity and nostalgia, and the fact that there are a lot of people with a lot of money, and companies that will cater to their needs. The best example might be Icon; they will do an engine & tranny swap, swap out the axles, re-do all the body-work, re-do the interior, and then you've got a brand new vehicle, with a stronger engine, better transmission, stronger axles, and a better suspension than the original - with no modern electronics interfering with driving the way God intended us to drive [Edit: some engine & tranny swaps result in modern electronics, while others - especially with manual transmissions - are left relatively free from modern electronics]

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=egjx406UB18

 

[six1five]

I have a 93 110 RoW here in the US. I’ll keep it as long as I can as it’s something I’ve always wanted. The Ineos will be a more refined version we can take on longer trips.

 

[Jeremy996]

Defenders were never cheap here, even when new they were priced much higher than in the UK.

My impression: Americans don't realize that the Defender was a working man's truck in the UK, and a farmer's truck, as well as a rich man's hunting vehicle. In the UK, the Defender really spanned all classes. Folks in the UK don't realize that here in the US, the Defender was never in reach for the working class.

The last year they were sold here was 1997. The insane price for these old vehicles is driven by rarity and nostalgia, and the fact that there are a lot of people with a lot of money, and companies that will cater to their needs. The best example might be Icon; they will do an engine & tranny swap, swap out the axles, re-do all the body-work, re-do the interior, and then you've got a brand new vehicle, with a stronger engine, better transmission, stronger axles, and a better suspension than the original - with no modern electronics interfering with driving the way God intended us to drive

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=egjx406UB18

I half expected my LR90 to end up in the USA, in the end it went to Kent, UK. One of the local independent LR specialists, Nene Overland does the Icon conversions; various 4, 5 and 8 cylinder engines and automatic gearboxes, axle swaps and quilted leather everywhere. Some of the engines run a lot of electronics.

I looked at the rebuild options before I ordered the Grenadier; my LR110 had done 200k miles since the last rebuild and really needed doing again. Just too painful to do again - time for someone else's dream. (The LR110 went to a couple in North Essex, who had stripped, rebuilt and repainted it in less than 6 months).