The Grenadier Forum

Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to contribute to the community by adding your own topics, posts, and connect with other members through your own private inbox! INEOS Agents, Dealers or Commercial vendors please use the contact us link at the bottom of the page.

Please send me your old ZF transmission pan and filter

No, just trying to figure out all the options for preventing damage to the ZF and other parts of the Grenadier in cases where one can't get under the vehicle to put ZF or the TC in forced neutral. I was an engineer at NASA, we identified, tested and practiced all manner of options for emergency procedures so they were well understood and didn't have to be figured out *during* the emergency. There's no time to look in the manual or go online to figure that stuff out. If I can't get the ZF into neutral or get under the car at all to put TC in neutral, I want options from inside the cabin if they exist. Towing a truck at speed is one use case, though probably not an emergency one, still useful to know what to do in that situation. And, well, I'm just curious, constantly. https://www.linkedin.com/in/scottgnet/
Hehe, I thought this subtopic was all done!

All good points Scott. Car wash mode keeps the trans in neutral for 30 minutes with the key on and the engine stopped. The context is to allocate for the vehicle to be shuttled through a car wash without the engine running. Typically the driver is still in the vehicle and it is unlocked. The time limit might be for security purposes. The number probably doesn't mean anything.

Back to recovery though; car wash mode is definitely an option if the vehicle still has electrical power and the engine can be started momentarily. But if the engine can be started you might as well leave it running and manually select neutral.
All the chatter about the neutral stop screw and it's poor second cousin the ZF parking pawl release lever, is for transportation and recovery situations where starting the engine may not be is an option.
Without power or engine, and without immediate access to the neutral stop screw, the most accessible other solution (no one said the easy option) is to find neutral in the transfer case. Then relocate the vehicle. Then apply the neutral stop screw to lock the transfer case in neutral. Now the vehicle can be towed or transported.
 
I was aware of your background. No worries, was just trying to figure out why time mattered so much. The function itself is of course useful.
Not advertising myself, just helps in the trust sense that I know what I'm doing maybe 10% of the time. Right now I'm just doing things. Time doesn't matter in this sense. I retired last day of 2023, so I do have time on my hands to dig into stuff even with consulting work, an LLC, family stuff. You know, it's weird, I don't know why I'm so focused on the Grenadier. My 4th gen 4Runner rusted out on me last year, I'd still be driving it otherwise. I was looking at getting a G63, really good vehicle, but it just didn't feel right, too comfy, I don't like it's proportions actually, feels like a box with too much vertical and not enough horizontal, and seems you want to buy an older one, the newer ones aren't really that reliable -- no evidence, just what I'm reading. Looked at the new Defender, they're really sexy but they're too sexy. I'm not an off-roader, but neither is the new Defender IMO. It can do it, yes, maybe as well as the Grenadier or better, but then it's in a fancy outfit and it feels like it's prancing around. And again the reliability, meh. Then was looking at 5th gen 4Runners because I did not trust the 6th gen now coming out, that needs time to 'ferment' as I often put it, and I forget where I saw it, probably watching a YouTube video and I'm like, hmm. So, Grenadier. I like the heritage, mom's a Brit, we lived there and in DE for 9 years total when I was growing up. Well, have I grown up, it's still an open question. The Grenadier is a mongrel, yes, a mongrel -- Brit company, DE drive train, FR built. I mean, damn, you even put the half UK / half DE flag on it (of course, I get the orange flag of the 1924 Belstaff, but I did by the intake plate with the UK/DE flag, so ...). I went to a mechanic I trust who runs his own shop and where I take our vehicles for service, he also rebuilds classic cars, a Pantera even, he showed me. He was currently "de-tuning" a leased Mercedes E class so the owner could turn it in for their next car, because Mercedes wouldn't take it in its highly tuned form. He has a ton of experience with BMWs, well, he's in the Bimmer camp so to speak, so, I was in for oil change on the 4th gen 4Runner and showed him what I was looking at getting, he'd never seen or heard of a Grenadier. First words out of his mouth were, "That's sick!" I peppered him with questions. Is the B58 a good engine? He said bulletproof, some of the stuff around it is a problem, but the core is solid. Can you work on this vehicle if I need you to? Yep. In fact, bring it in after warranty is up and I'll re-tune the engine (meaning he would take it apart and replace all manner of components so it would be a rocket. I get the irony). I'm not big into cars and never have been, but call me obsessed, the Grenadier is just awesome. Yes, I know it has a lot of issues, I get that there's risk in getting a car from a company that is barely what, 8 years old? And only started selling vehicles a few years ago? Who starts a new car company, not a sub-brand of an existing one, but a NEW car company, in the 2020s? Oh it took me a loooooooong time to decide. Finally went for a test drive. F***. Had no doubt after that. Funny story, my wife, showed her the Grenadier online -- you want to get THAT? Went to see it in person and test drive. "Hmm, they're ok." She came with me to pick up my pre-ordered 1924 in May, walked around the showroom again. "Wow, I really like these."

Apologies, didn't mean to go into all that detail. Bottom line, you'll pry this Grenadier from my cold, dead hands. Might get a second one, would love a Magic Mushroom 1924, but hear there's a "Black Edition" coming out soon? People will complain and be upset about stuff, but that's ok, not asking anyone to want to be doing what I am. I'll deal with the seeping HT and LT reservoirs, the bonging that sometimes happens out of nowhere when I jump over a curb (don't ask), the lack of access to the online manual (hello, INEOS Automotive. Three months. Still waiting.). I'll deal with the plastic oil filter housing giving up the ghost one day, replacing it with an aluminum one, and whatever. I look for reasons to drive. "What?!? We're out of SALT??? That's a crime! Be back in an hour." One day maybe I'll post the story about the BMW X7 that dove into the bushes when I crested the hill to the BMW service center near me to pick up an oil filter. It was probably an X3, but you know how it goes -- "I once caught a fish that was THIS BIGGGG!" Or the time a few months ago where I went off-road to avoid a ticket from the Florida Highway Patrol (true story, nothing sinister or illegal, it just kind of happened). Maybe the Grenadier isn't as reliable as people want, but it is at its core, but we'll see. And what vehicle these days is more reliable? GM, Toyota engines bricking themselves; Land Rover / Defenders, newer ones, horrible track record for reliability. Mercedes is frankly in the shitter for reliability. Jaguar? Jeep? Ummm, yeeeeaaaah. Sure. Vehicles where I have to pay a subscription for a heated seat? I have four letter words for them. I have frickin Recaro seats, I've never sat in a car and felt so comfortable in a seat before. And they're not even power seats! The steering is fine, I like it, won't change it. I get why others will, that's ok, I do think it should be a factory option. So, it's enough for me.

I'll stop here. Was going to say to make a long story short, but too late. Cheers, and Happy New Year :)

./s
 
Hehe, I thought this subtopic was all done!

All good points Scott. Car wash mode keeps the trans in neutral for 30 minutes with the key on and the engine stopped. The context is to allocate for the vehicle to be shuttled through a car wash without the engine running. Typically the driver is still in the vehicle and it is unlocked. The time limit might be for security purposes. The number probably doesn't mean anything.

Back to recovery though; car wash mode is definitely an option if the vehicle still has electrical power and the engine can be started momentarily. But if the engine can be started you might as well leave it running and manually select neutral.
All the chatter about the neutral stop screw and it's poor second cousin the ZF parking pawl release lever, is for transportation and recovery situations where starting the engine may not be is an option.
Without power or engine, and without immediate access to the neutral stop screw, the most accessible other solution (no one said the easy option) is to find neutral in the transfer case. Then relocate the vehicle. Then apply the neutral stop screw to lock the transfer case in neutral. Now the vehicle can be towed or transported.
I only got up to 30 minutes, could be much longer, maybe forever, it's not documented as far as I can tell. Goal is to get vehicle safe, neutral in the TC is the last resort, but if you have no power, I'm not sure you can be certain you have the TC in neutral. I agree you want to use these methods until you can get underneath to manually activate neutral in the TC and/or ZF. I'm not an expert in any of these areas.
 
Back
Top Bottom