Owl Vans Grenadier Steering Box Upgrade

[Dokatd]

I personally think everyone should be required to drive in an old VW bug that's poorly tuned, has no choke and a bad starter for at least the first year of their license.

I built a Baja Bug specifically for my little brother to learn and abuse as his first car. It was a riot to drive and a serious learning experience for him.

 

[DoubleDoom]

After watching the Owl video, it seems (towards the end of the video) that he is still micro correcting (despite those micro corrections not doing anything as they are within the steering wheel play). Plus, early in the video, the return to centre seems similar to mine. i.e. does return to centre but not fast and just needs a helping hand towards the end. Plus, I can lift my hands of the wheel at 70mph and it will drive straight. So, not sure what it would offer me.

 

[Dlucky]

After watching the Owl video, it seems (towards the end of the video) that he is still micro correcting (despite those micro corrections not doing anything as they are within the steering wheel play). Plus, early in the video, the return to centre seems similar to mine. i.e. does return to centre but not fast and just needs a helping hand towards the end. Plus, I can lift my hands of the wheel at 70mph and it will drive straight. So, not sure what it would offer me.

I’d pay the $2500 just to make the pump noise go away. I don’t think the steering is terrible at freeway speeds. Maybe I’m delusional.

 

[LRNAD90]

I’d pay the $2500 just to make the pump noise go away. I don’t think the steering is terrible at freeway speeds. Maybe I’m delusional.

But you SHOULDN'T HAVE TO! That should be included in the already high price of the vehicle.

 

[MileHigh]

I’d pay the $2500 just to make the pump noise go away. I don’t think the steering is terrible at freeway speeds. Maybe I’m delusional.

Agreed, but if that is what the market is asking for- to ‘fix’ the steering…. I ‘one-hand’ the IG all the time on the highway, both stock and when I had 2d of caster added last month. Yes, over bumpy/constrction pavement at 60mph, it is a handful, or two hands full, but that is the nature of the beast.

But you SHOULDN'T HAVE TO! That should be included in the already high price of the vehicle.

WHAT?!? I CAN’T HEAR YOU OVER THE STEERING PUMP WHINING…

 

[Zimm]

We have 3 vehicles and twins that just turned 16 this week-

2006/7 FJ Cruiser that we have owned since new
2021 Ford Bronco First Edition
2024 Grenadier

The Bronco is the easiest for them to drive- Tracks straight, blind spot and cross traffic alert, AEB, front and rear parking sensors, 360 camera, reasonable blind spot
FJ Cruiser - The one they will be driving- No tech, No Carplay, No Bluetooth, no cameras, horrible blind spot. Decent on the highway. Sat in a lawn chair and had my daughter change the oil and my son rotate the tires. I reminded the kids that I have had the car longer than I have had them
Grenadier- No BLIS + no return to center + plus doesn't track as well on the highway. I am not saying never, but its a last resort that they drive this.

Wife walks to work and I have a company car, so they really could be driving any of the three. The best option would probably be to sell the FJ and buy a new Corolla or Civic with new tech. My wife would kill me though.

New drivers have a lot to learn, there is no shame in giving them an advantage, or the Grenadier's case a disadvantage. Sure they all "should" be able to drive stick, double clutch it, no power steering, no power brakes and have non return to center steering, but why make it harder...

If you have the means (likely you do if a Grenadier is not your primary vehicle), then why wouldn't you avoid trouble by giving your kids something easier to drive?

I would say 1) you're conflating easier to LEARN with easier to DRIVE once you learn. 2) you don't know what you don't know. If you just tossed them in the gren, that would be their normal. 3) we're actually off topic from my post. I said learning something more complicated does make you better at using something less complicated. I wasn't discussing the process of learning I was discussing the process of doing.

That all having been said, my ability to singlehand a 50' yacht will not translate into me winning races with a dinghies. ...I'm of the opinion, if you want to sail, just go buy the boat youre going to sail and screw "working your way up".

I'm not going to be better racing a car with paddle shifters because I can race a car with a manual.

 

[Zimm]

Ah... my truck tracks straight and does not wander after the process I posted. If you had ever driven a new E350 van, it's about the same. There's no feel, but it's fine. I just did 1/4 mile with my hand off the wheel texting yesterday. That's almost 3000 miles so, I think the theory's suggesting bushings being compressed isn't it, if there was any binding to correct the geometry, it would have unbound by now. It's perfectly safe as a first car. If yours is wandering and not tracking, stop thinking you know whats going on and get it to a good dealer and have it looked at. The plant apparently fucks everything up.

And yes, I have other trucks and sports cars, so I know what good steering feels like.

 

[HereinDaRockies]

I have driven enough units to observe a spectrum of different steering characteristics.

Steering is FINE if your vehicle is well adjusted - alignment and caster. Apply those strategies first.

It would be advised to immediately go down the path of aftermarket stabilizer or pump, simply to improve steering feel.

 

[Dlucky]

But you SHOULDN'T HAVE TO! That should be included in the already high price of the vehicle.

Agree. Not likely going to happen via INEOS

 

[Adamc1303]

I'd pay for getting a normal turning radius. I love my car but I am really getting tired of having to make the extra maneuvers. Every cheap car just makes u turns and pulls out of parking spots so much easier.

 

[LRNAD90]

I'd pay for getting a normal turning radius. I love my car but I am really getting tired of having to make the extra maneuvers. Every cheap car just makes u turns and pulls out of parking spots so much easier.

Have you adjusted your steering stops?

 

[MileHigh]

I’d like to get the official OK from Ineos on the steering stops.

I totally understand the issue with the Grenadier’s steering circle, but in some ways I think it’s inherent with with the vehicle. Most other SUVs and 4 x 4‘s have smaller, turning radius, but usually only when you’ve had them in 2 Wheel Dr. mode. It would seem that when a four-wheel-drive mode that they have worse, turning radius than the Grenadier. Even my Tahoe in four-wheel-drive had an increased turning radius. At least in the other cars, you can put them into a wheel drive and have a small, turning radius, but are there any real competitors with the same full-time four-wheel-drive system? I’m not talking about all-wheel-drive.

 

[LRNAD90]

I’d like to get the official OK from Ineos on the steering stops.

I totally understand the issue with the Grenadier’s steering circle, but in some ways I think it’s inherent with with the vehicle. Most other SUVs and 4 x 4‘s have smaller, turning radius, but usually only when you’ve had them in 2 Wheel Dr. mode. It would seem that when a four-wheel-drive mode that they have worse, turning radius than the Grenadier. Even my Tahoe in four-wheel-drive had an increased turning radius. At least in the other cars, you can put them into a wheel drive and have a small, turning radius, but are there any real competitors with the same full-time four-wheel-drive system? I’m not talking about all-wheel-drive.

Not a straight comparison, the Grenadier has a center differential, so its not comparable to a part time 4wd vehicle, who's turning radius will increase and tires will scrub when in 4wd because there is not differentiation between front and rear axles. To make your comparison realistic, you'd have to lock the Grenadier's center diff, and you will experience a reduction in turning radius and tires scrub, like other when other part time 4wd systems are engaged.

There are plenty of vehicles that use similar 4wd systems (full time with center differential). Classic Land Rovers are probably the best example, but plenty of others (several Jeeps depending upon 4wd option, etc) have full time options with a center diff, some that can be locked, some that cannot...

 

[Dokatd]

Not a straight comparison, the Grenadier has a center differential, so its not comparable to a part time 4wd vehicle, who's turning radius will increase and tires will scrub when in 4wd because there is not differentiation between front and rear axles. To make your comparison realistic, you'd have to lock the Grenadier's center diff, and you will experience a reduction in turning radius and tires scrub, like other when other part time 4wd systems are engaged.

There are plenty of vehicles that use similar 4wd systems (full time with center differential). Classic Land Rovers are probably the best example, but plenty of others (several Jeeps depending upon 4wd option, etc) have full time options with a center diff, some that can be locked, some that cannot...

G wagon has same center lock design and is full time 4wd. It's the best modern comparison I would think. I even have a video on YouTube showing the steering circle of both the Gwagon and Grenadier in unlocked condition.

I’d like to get the official OK from Ineos on the steering stops.

This will absolutely never happen.