New Defender vs Ineos Grenadier

[To]

I have a new Defender and love it. I was thinking of cancelling my Grenadier order to allow us to run a smaller car alongside, like a Yeti or Golf maybe, but I’ve decided to stick with the order and to run the Grenadier alongside the Defender. My only other thought a while back was to get a second hand Discovery 4 but finding a good one wasn’t easy. I’ve been blown away by the Defender’s ease of driving and the seating position is brilliant. I had it up on Salisbury plain yesterday in some really tough off road tracks and it coped with everything easily. A lot of my off-roading is in Scotland so a lot of motorway to be covered there and back. I want to be sure the Grenadier is comfortable doing that but, as yet, still no opportunity to drive on tarmac. Encouraged by first post in this thread but ultimately we have to pass judgement as individuals. The good thing is that Grenadier has acquired a remarkably loyal following already through testing programme in exciting regions around the world. I can’t judge yet on the basis of a shortish test drive on a pretty tame off-road track. No way will I swap my Defender for a Grenadier. My opinion may change as I drive the Grenadier. But right now the Defender wins out for me.

As long as it work.

 

[DCPU]

Side question ~ where would Ineos rank in this table right now.

 

[stickshifter]

I have a new Defender and love it. I was thinking of cancelling my Grenadier order to allow us to run a smaller car alongside, like a Yeti or Golf maybe, but I’ve decided to stick with the order and to run the Grenadier alongside the Defender. My only other thought a while back was to get a second hand Discovery 4 but finding a good one wasn’t easy. I’ve been blown away by the Defender’s ease of driving and the seating position is brilliant. I had it up on Salisbury plain yesterday in some really tough off road tracks and it coped with everything easily. A lot of my off-roading is in Scotland so a lot of motorway to be covered there and back. I want to be sure the Grenadier is comfortable doing that but, as yet, still no opportunity to drive on tarmac. Encouraged by first post in this thread but ultimately we have to pass judgement as individuals. The good thing is that Grenadier has acquired a remarkably loyal following already through testing programme in exciting regions around the world. I can’t judge yet on the basis of a shortish test drive on a pretty tame off-road track. No way will I swap my Defender for a Grenadier. My opinion may change as I drive the Grenadier. But right now the Defender wins out for me.

You have to get the vehicle that best meets your needs, and everyone's needs (and wants) are different!

 

[@nd]

Side question ~ where would Ineos rank in this table right now.

two below Land Rover after DeLorean

 

[Jean Mercier]

Side question ~ where would Ineos rank in this table right now.

In mathematics 0/0 = undefined number, So, you can rank it wherever you like

 

[Stu_Barnes]

Time is what usually changes one's mind about a JLR product, that and an over familiarity with the local main dealer service manager.

Latest customer satisfaction survey:

Suzuki customers are the most satisfied – but Land Rover is bottom of league

The manufacturers’ scores were as follows for January 2023, with their January 2022 score in brackets:

Suzuki: 84.6 (84.0)
Kia: 82.3 (81.7)
Hyundai: 82.2 (81.8)
Audi: 81.7 (80.5)
Mercedes-Benz: 81.5 (79.9)
Seat: 81.5 (76.8)
BMW: 81.2 (83.9)
Toyota: 81.1 (82.0)
Honda: 81.0 (81.5)
Lexus: 81.0 (79.7)
Ford: 80.6 (81.6)
Dacia: 80.3 (83.3)
Volkswagen: 80.1 (79.5)
Tesla: 80.0 (80.1)
Volvo: 79.6 (77.8)
Nissan: 79.2 (84.3)
Skoda UK: 79.0 (85.2)
Peugeot: 79.0 (78.6)
Mazda: 78.8 (80.5)
Jaguar: 78.5 (79.8)
Mitsubishi: 78.3 (75.6)
Mini: 78.3 (78.5)
Fiat: 77.2 (73.5)
Vauxhall: 77.0 (79.2)
Renault: 76.8 (79.0)
Citroen: 76.7 (76.7)
Land Rover: 76.1 (75.4)

Car Dealer Magazine

The latest in UK motor trade news, covering car dealers, car manufacturers, workshops and more

cardealermagazine.co.uk

That spread isn’t too big. But I am surprised that MG aren’t there being the UK’s 12’th largest brand.

I’m pretty sure where ineos would be if this was customer service though…….

But it’ll be worth it in the end.

I hope…..

To finish up. I really like the new defender and as it’s a straight 6 coupled to the same gearbox (basically) as the Grenadier then I’m not too fussed with the perceived lack of power.

 

[DCPU]

To finish up. I really like the new defender and as it’s a straight 6 coupled to the same gearbox (basically) as the Grenadier then I’m not too fussed with the perceived lack of power.

Don't forget the two clutch packs in the driveline. They must change the feel.

 

[CountyV8]

Don't forget the two clutch packs in the driveline. They must change the feel.

Not as good as 3 locked diffs. Discuss?

 

[Stu_Barnes]

Not too much. The Defender, RR sport both with same engine and my LR4/Disco4 with the supercharged v6 all feel very similar to be honest. Although the D4 is noticeably more sluggish not having the electric supercharger turbocharger combo and being almost a tonne heavier :/

The power delivery is pretty smooth.

I’m hoping the Grenadier will be like the D4 in that respect.

 

[Jean Mercier]

@Stu_Barnes I only notice now that you use the UN flag ... excuse me ... United Nations flag in your profile, nice.
As long as you are not speaking about the Organization but about the concept I love it!

I have some negative thoughts about the Organization of the UN (UNO), because of some professional experience with it, and it is even not politics related! But OK, not a topic here!

 

[Stu_Barnes]

Not as good as 3 locked diffs. Discuss?

Well one good thing with the clutch pack rear diff is that if you step on the loud pedal from a standing start the rear diff locks up for you.

 

[DCPU]

But yours isn't /wasn't the new AWD system?

 

[CountyV8]

Having driven both the petrol and the diesel I can confirm that the power delivery is indeed smooth.

 

[Stu_Barnes]

@Stu_Barnes I only notice now that you use the UN flag ... excuse me ... United Nations flag in your profile, nice.
As long as you are not speaking about the Organization but about the concept I love it!

I have some negative thoughts about the Organization of the UN (UNO), because of some professional experience with it, and it is even not politics related! But OK, not a topic here!

Totally OT but yes. I’ve lived in a dozen countries and visited over a hundred. So I feel like a bit of a mongrel and world citizen at this point.

 

[Stu_Barnes]

But yours isn't /wasn't the new AWD system?

D4 permanent 4wd. (That’s why I’m thinking it’ll be a pretty close comparison to the Grenadier with regards to power delivery) Not sure about the RR sport, I’ll have to look at the hand book.
And for the Defender. I couldn’t really tell on or off road. I know that’s not people want to hear. But the system worked well when it had to. Long term. I’m not too sure……

 

[DCPU]

Not as good as 3 locked diffs. Discuss?

I can dig out the Technical Service Bulletins that describe some of the various issues they've been having which very much make me conclude it's far too clever for it's own good.

 

[DCPU]

Well one good thing with the clutch pack rear diff is that if you step on the loud pedal from a standing start the rear diff locks up for you.

But is that because the AWD is running in just rear wheel drive as a default?

 

[Stu_Barnes]

But is that because the AWD is running in just rear wheel drive as a default?

Not on the D4 no it’s permanent 4wd

 

[Spjnr]

D4 permanent 4wd. (That’s why I’m thinking it’ll be a pretty close comparison to the Grenadier with regards to power delivery) Not sure about the RR sport, I’ll have to look at the hand book.
And for the Defender. I couldn’t really tell on or off road. I know that’s not people want to hear. But the system worked well when it had to. Long term. I’m not too sure……

Driving the Grenadier it felt like a cross between a JL wrangler and a D4. That was my impression. D4 in heft and power, JL in its pointability and manners offroad

 

[Stu_Barnes]

Driving the Grenadier it felt like a cross between a JL wrangler and a D4. That was my impression. D4 in heft and power, JL in its pointability and manners offroad

I’m hoping the same but without death wobble.