Diff locks question

[trobex]

Winch and steel cable as back up!!! Being stuck is the worst, especially when your vehicle is cutting into mud sideways and a foot away is a 500m drop... to more mud!

 

[bemax]

Simple answer is that yes, CDL and high/low range will be all you need if you are not doing anything too complicated.

The best thing you can buy yourself is a decent 4wd course with a qualified off road instructor. They will show you what your vehicle can and cannot do, and teach you how to use it in various offroad situations. And they’ll help you buy recovery gear that will be appropriate for where you are likely to take your vehicle. Or join a 4wd club if they exist where you are.

And if you do so you will find out that a well trained driver with „only“ CDL will most times outdrive an untrained one with three lockers by choosing the better track, speed and gear. Or by just stopping and turn around without destroying the car!

 

[Tazzieman]

And if you do so you will find out that a well trained driver with „only“ CDL will most times outdrive an untrained one with three lockers by choosing the better track, speed and gear. Or by just stopping and turn around without destroying the car!

For each such driver there are at least 1000 jokers , many of whom view themselves as entertainers - if not social media grifters.

 

[bemax]

For each such driver there are at least 1000 jokers , many of whom view themselves as entertainers - if not social media grifters.

I have been under the 1000 for some years if I am honest
Anyone else here as well?

 

[BD1]

Think of the CDL as keeping you moving forward if either the front or the rear wheels have grip.
FDL/RDL keep you moving if either the left side or the right side have grip.

Excellent summary

 

[Tom D]

You can go a long way with just a centre differential lock. The old defender was tell regarded for its off Road abilities and it only had a centre diff lock as standard.

 

[Scott_USA]

This is what I've learned from Ineos Customer Service and hope new owners will chime in as they take delivery:

“We do have guidelines on using the CDL and this will be given during the handover stage for the vehicle. After researching more into this and speaking with one of the engineers it does appear there are no limits for this as far as speed is concerned. But of course during the handover we will go through any concerns you may have and we will explain the limits of the mechanics and misuse cases which may cause damage if the differential locks are engaged unnecessarily.”

 

[bigleonski]

This is what I've learned from Ineos Customer Service and hope new owners will chime in as they take delivery:

“We do have guidelines on using the CDL and this will be given during the handover stage for the vehicle. After researching more into this and speaking with one of the engineers it does appear there are no limits for this as far as speed is concerned. But of course during the handover we will go through any concerns you may have and we will explain the limits of the mechanics and misuse cases which may cause damage if the differential locks are engaged unnecessarily.”

The only problem I have with this is that the level of competency between Ineos dealers I would suggest would be broad. I’d suggest that some dealers would be seasoned offroaders with a strong understanding of mechanics, and others would be salespeople who’s offroad knowledge would be limited to what the handbook told them. I may be wrong, but I’m cynical by nature.

 

[bemax]

The only problem I have with this is that the level of competency between Ineos dealers I would suggest would be broad. I’d suggest that some dealers would be seasoned offroaders with a strong understanding of mechanics, and others would be salespeople who’s offroad knowledge would be limited to what the handbook told them. I may be wrong, but I’m cynical by nature.

Absolutely! As my dealer drives a Defender himself and probably will own an Ineos in future as well I guess that he understands the technical aspects of low range and diff locks.
So will every dealer with some other real 4x4 cars in the showroom. But I would not bet that every „normal“ salesperson is really interested in understanding the connections.

 

[globalgregors]

situations where the surface is patchy and very slippery, or so uneven that you might have two wheels off the ground diagonally.

A great example pictured below. So in this situation with CDL only you would proceed but with wheel spin (and therefore loss of motive power) on the port rear wheel and (if/when the driver steers to the left) the starboard front wheel.

This would be unlikely to be an issue in this case in terms of forward progress. Even if it did, the typical driver would instinctively let gravity take the vehicle down into the rut, where traction would be regained at the risk of 'running aground' (running out of ramp-over clearance). If this occurs, it may be necessary to recover the vehicle by lifting it with a jack (high lift or exhaust) and building the track beneath the suspended wheel until the chassis is lifted from the ground.

With FDL/RDL, locking the wheels on each side to each other, this spin-up would not occur, meaning that the same progress would be maintained, but at a reduced throttle opening and generally with more calm and control, and so the driver would be less tempted to release the vehicle to gravity.

This is what one means by a "more deliberate approach".

 

[Jean Mercier]

The only problem I have with this is that the level of competency between Ineos dealers I would suggest would be broad. I’d suggest that some dealers would be seasoned offroaders with a strong understanding of mechanics, and others would be salespeople who’s offroad knowledge would be limited to what the handbook told them. I may be wrong, but I’m cynical by nature.

Neither my dealer manager, neither his assistant have 'real" experience driving a 4X4! I am curious what kind of handover explanation I will get! But I don't mind.

 

[bemax]

Neither my dealer manager, neither his assistant have 'real" experience driving a 4X4! I am curious what kind of handover explanation I will get! But I don't mind.

Wrong approach Jean!
They both will get a proper handover of information from you. You will only get the keys.

 

[DaveB]

Neither my dealer manager, neither his assistant have 'real" experience driving a 4X4! I am curious what kind of handover explanation I will get! But I don't mind.

In my experience 80-90% of people who buy 4wd/SUV have no experience driving a 4x4
Nor do 80-90% of people who drive a 4WD/SUV daily

 

[MileHigh]

Are the axles limited slip when ‘open’? If one wheel is hanging or in a really slick spot. Is there a limit to keep both tires moving at least a bit? Or because it is full time four wheel drive, you are usually moving due to some axle having traction. My Jeeps had all the 4x4 magic kind of baked in (JGCs),

 

[AnD3rew]

Are the axles limited slip when ‘open’? If one wheel is hanging or in a really slick spot. Is there a limit to keep both tires moving at least a bit? Or because it is full time four wheel drive, you are usually moving due to some axle having traction. My Jeeps had all the 4x4 magic kind of baked in (JGCs),

I think you will find what you are experiencing is electonic traction control not a limited slip diff. The traction control brakes a wheel that is turning significantly faster than the one on the other side. My understanding is that the Grenadier does have a traction control although I don’t think it’s multimodal like a Land Rover or Mitsubishi one I don’t know how much or when it intervenes though, and it turns off if you engage the front or rear diff locks

 

[MileHigh]

I think you will find what you are experiencing is electonic traction control not a limited slip diff. The traction control brakes a wheel that is turning significantly faster than the one on the other side. My understanding is that the Grenadier does have a traction control although I don’t think it’s multimodal like a Land Rover or Mitsubishi one I don’t know how much or when it intervenes though, and it turns off if you engage the front or rear diff locks

Ah, thanks. So there is some black box majic that happens, it isn’t purely mechanical.