First Delivery?????

[Krabby]

What changes were you planning to change? Why?

 

[Davman]

It appears that most of the March / April Australian builds got pushed into the “January build date” category.

Changes can still be made via the dealer, but they cannot make them on their portal any longer. The dealer has to complete “ a form” and submit that to INEOS to make the changes from their end.

 

[DaveB]

I’ve had a March 2023 build date from the outset, which hasn’t changed during the various delays. On the portal my build date has not been provided for a while and as of today my build date it is still not showing.

I contacted my selected agent this morning (Purnell, in Sydney) for the first time to make a few configuration changes post driving IG on the weekend at the Sydney (Cessnock) event - as per the discussion here on March build dates being locked in early Jan 2023.

The surprise/kicker was being told that my vehicle has a build date of January 2023, not March 2023, and that the window for configuration changes for my vehicle is closed. We all here know how bad communication from Ineos has been, so I will not go over that ground again. I never did hear back from the Global Head of PR from Ineos Automotive when I provided constructive feedback many months ago.

My advice to everyone that has not already contacted their agent, is to make contact with their agent and find out when their assigned build date is, irrespective of what the portal is/isn’t displaying.

That's a double edged sword if ever there was one.
Yay - it is getting built (hopefully delivered) 2 months earlier than expected.
Boo - you now can't make the changes you wanted.
Hopefully the Yay will outweigh the Boo

 

[OGrid]

What changes were you planning to change? Why?

• Access ladder
• High Load Auxiliary Switch Panel & Electrical Preparation
• Interior Utility Rails

Access ladder - vehicle looks naked now to me without it and on inspecting the access ladder on the weekend it looked well seated on the door.

High Load Auxiliary - more of an investment in future accessories which I’ll regret later if I don’t. Discussion on this forum the last few months have really provided a solid level of detail on what this actually contains.

Interior Rails - seeing the vehicle again on the weekend the rails are well designed and don’t protrude. The recent discussion on this forum about Ineos and other suppliers offering a drawer accessory I think is a winner to level that back area out. I’m guessing the rails are required for this. Also seeing the additional pics DCPU was able to obtain on the Namibia vehicles it was clear to me for my purposes the Interior rails were a mandatory item (they used tie downs for 35” tyres in the back, bring it on).

 

[Tazzieman]

My advice to everyone that has not already contacted their agent, is to make contact with their agent and find out when their assigned build date is, irrespective of what the portal is/isn’t displaying.

My agent rang me back today after I msged him last week. All changes ( bolt ons) communicated to Ineos in London. Said I should be issued with a contract very soon ( a week or so). We'll see.

 

[DaveB]

• Access ladder
• High Load Auxiliary Switch Panel & Electrical Preparation
• Interior Utility Rails

Access ladder - vehicle looks naked now to me without it and on inspecting the access ladder on the weekend it looked well seated on the door.

High Load Auxiliary - more of an investment in future accessories which I’ll regret later if I don’t. Discussion on this forum the last few months have really provided a solid level of detail on what this actually contains.

Interior Rails - seeing the vehicle again on the weekend the rails are well designed and don’t protrude. The recent discussion on this forum about Ineos and other suppliers offering a drawer accessory I think is a winner to level that back area out. I’m guessing the rails are required for this. Also seeing the additional pics DCPU was able to obtain on the Namibia vehicles it was clear to me for my purposes the Interior rails were a mandatory item (they used tie downs for 35” tyres in the back, bring it on).

The access ladder and utility rails can be added later as an accessory
The auxiliary wiring however can't be.

 

[painter]

I’ve had a March 2023 build date from the outset, which hasn’t changed during the various delays. On the portal my build date has not been provided for a while and as of today my build date it is still not showing.

I contacted my selected agent this morning (Purnell, in Sydney) for the first time to make a few configuration changes post driving IG on the weekend at the Sydney (Cessnock) event - as per the discussion here on March build dates being locked in early Jan 2023.

The surprise/kicker was being told that my vehicle has a build date of January 2023, not March 2023, and that the window for configuration changes for my vehicle is closed. We all here know how bad communication from Ineos has been, so I will not go over that ground again. I never did hear back from the Global Head of PR from Ineos Automotive when I provided constructive feedback many months ago.

My advice to everyone that has not already contacted their agent, is to make contact with their agent and find out when their assigned build date is, irrespective of what the portal is/isn’t displaying.

Bummer. Any chance you're getting the brush off from the dealer ? ( notwithstanding Davman's subsequent comment)

Sucks that buyers with orders get an opportunity to test drive before delivery but after the window for order changes closes (!)

Hopefully the overhead panel won't be too onerous to retrofit.

 

[Tazzieman]

Hopefully the overhead panel won't be too onerous to retrofit.

It isn't possible after the car is built.

 

[DenisM]

It isn't possible after the car is built.

Heavy duty overhead panel wiring (which includes the external rooftop fittings), f/r locking diffs, safari windows were amongst items listed "early on" which had to be incorporated from the beginning of the build...

 

[grenadierboy]

My agent rang me back today after I msged him last week. All changes ( bolt ons) communicated to Ineos in London. Said I should be issued with a contract very soon ( a week or so). We'll see.

Don't hold your breath.

My (very proactive) agent told me 2 weeks ago that a contract for my December build (that's right - only 14 more working days left in the month!) would be issued very soon.

Still waiting.

 

[DenisM]

Don't hold your breath.

My (very proactive) agent told me 2 weeks ago that a contract for my December build (that's right - only 14 more working days left in the month!) would be issued very soon.

Still waiting.

I'll remove my "old man in a hurry" hat and relax until the drive day on this Friday when I shall 'diplomatically' probe the issues... I am sure the local Ineos people are just as frustrated.

 

[DaveB]

I'll remove my "old man in a hurry" hat and relax until the drive day on this Friday when I shall 'diplomatically' probe the issues... I am sure the local Ineos people are just as frustrated.

Not sure who will be at the drives this weekend.
Just said it will be a different crew and that he and Tom won't be there.
Would make sense if the local dealers were there.
I will send them a message and ask

 

[ADVAW8S]

I’ve had a March 2023 build date from the outset, which hasn’t changed during the various delays. On the portal my build date has not been provided for a while and as of today my build date it is still not showing.

I contacted my selected agent this morning (Purnell, in Sydney) for the first time to make a few configuration changes post driving IG on the weekend at the Sydney (Cessnock) event - as per the discussion here on March build dates being locked in early Jan 2023.

The surprise/kicker was being told that my vehicle has a build date of January 2023, not March 2023, and that the window for configuration changes for my vehicle is closed. We all here know how bad communication from Ineos has been, so I will not go over that ground again. I never did hear back from the Global Head of PR from Ineos Automotive when I provided constructive feedback many months ago.

My advice to everyone that has not already contacted their agent, is to make contact with their agent and find out when their assigned build date is, irrespective of what the portal is/isn’t displaying.

That sucks, I would put the blame on the agent. I know they all cant be like Steve but they can do better

 

[DCPU]

The auxiliary wiring however can't be.

It would be rather funny if all the wiring is actually there and just the overhead panel is missing.

I'm reminded of the number of bits in various Landrovers, from heated seats, adaptive cruise control, fuel burning heaters, where all the wiring is part of standard looms and the plugs are just waiting from the hardware to be plugged in.

 

[DenisM]

It would be rather funny if all the wiring is actually there and just the overhead panel is missing.

I'm reminded of the number of bits in various Landrovers, from heated seats, adaptive cruise control, fuel burning heaters, where all the wiring is part of standard looms and the plugs are just waiting from the hardware to be plugged in.

It could be a bonus if it were.... however given the cost of copper wire and the precision with which wiring looms are manufactured these days, 50 cents per vehicle shaved from production price is prized by cost accountants

edit: then I thought about Tesla, Hyundai, BMW and MB for example where the "infrastructure" is in place and the owner forks out extra on a subscription basis to activate the feature.. e.g. extra power, heated seats etc... . I "thought" I read in the early days that the high load electric option on the Grenadier was installed while access was available for the heavy duty wiring. My understanding was that some of this wiring is actually routed through the A pillar which makes it difficult to fit after its been "sealed".

 

[DaveB]

It could be a bonus if it were.... however given the cost of copper wire and the precision with which wiring looms are manufactured these days, 50 cents per vehicle shaved from production price is prized by cost accountants

edit: then I thought about Tesla, Hyundai, BMW and MB for example where the "infrastructure" is in place and the owner forks out extra on a subscription basis to activate the feature.. e.g. extra power, heated seats etc... . I "thought" I read in the early days that the high load electric option on the Grenadier was installed while access was available for the heavy duty wiring. My understanding was that some of this wiring is actually routed through the A pillar which makes it difficult to fit after its been "sealed".

We sell instruments with lots of options that are firmware enabled.
So they are always there you just have to pay to release them
Anything physical is not included as every cent counts in a competitive market

 

[klarie]

We sell instruments with lots of options that are firmware enabled.
So they are always there you just have to pay to release them
Anything physical is not included as every cent counts in a competitive market

Last week I was travelling together with a friend.. He has a company car BMW X3 hybrid.
Indeed - Seatheaters and features are likely to be subscription based in the future - Dont know - pay per use or fee per annum.

I can understand that there is a fee on navigation maps that are frequently updated or software that is maintained and features added ( not bugfixes -that should fall under warranty agreement) But not technical equipment. - Either I rent a vehicle - full service - except fuels. or I purchase ist. Once I purchase it - anything that is inside is mine. I can use all capabilities as agreed. Modify etc.
Car as a service? - Maybe. In this case I would rather opt for a rental or car sharing scheme.
But purchasing a vehicle and subscribe for options .. nice try.. Some people may like this .. some not (Including me) Probably go to another vendor then. Glad Ineos is more on the customer side there. I ve got the impression of Ineos Grenadier it is quite close to "open source" as we call it in IT.
Customers invoked in Betatesting and Ramp Up, - Interfaces open, - 3rd Party suppliers disclosed - We know from beginning what is inside and what can be done. No "Vendor lock in" If that is the market model and successful - I would wonder how an Ineos classic on road vehicle would look like then if they ever decide to develop one.

The open communication of Ineos was always impressing me from beginning..
And I know what I definitely do NOT want and certainly do not purchase..

 

[Krabby]

The thought of subscription-based car features is maddening. I think it’s been noted elsewhere on the site, but New Jersey USA has initiated legislation to ban the practice before it really gets traction.

 

[DenisM]

The thought of subscription-based car features is maddening. I think it’s been noted elsewhere on the site, but New Jersey USA has initiated legislation to ban the practice before it really gets traction.

That's great news!!!

 

[klarie]

The thought of subscription-based car features is maddening. I think it’s been noted elsewhere on the site, but New Jersey USA has initiated legislation to ban the practice before it really gets traction.

Its probably copied from cloud computing. - So some new kid managers the way of services as they are available as cloud service. So ERP from that company - the Geocoding from there, address verification from this company. Also copiers and printers or even compressors - pay per use.
However - the difference is there is no Vendor lock in. - The communication is near "standard" REST SSL - so it should be relatively easy to plug in an alternative service.
The copiers/ printers and even air compressors - So if do a pay per print / pay per copy or even air volume - we do NOT care about any technology - paper, electric energy, toners or maintenance - is subject of the vendor. And so we look at competition.

In a car - you cannot kickout the seats and replace it by a subscription from another seat provider. So this is what I call vendor lock in.
It should be clear what is mine and what is vendors. - I do not purchase a car and pay extra on top. That has a fraudy / fishy smell.
I am glad at least in this case the government intervenes.

Also - I predict in case of Tesla and others - there will likely be hackers that go after software.. and perhaps a disabling and unlocking business that will be established.
With all (dis-) advantages and side effects such as court cases, legality etc.. Ownership topics etc.

In example Audi - had at least sometime its contract that vehicle data is transmitted to Audi - and either the purchase has to accept it or no purchase at all. This is the next escalation.