Emergency Brake Yes/No

[Logsplitter]

I use the handbrake all the time when parked up and also at traffic lights/traffic queues, when I’m waiting a while. I just leave in drive with handbrake on and release when ready.

 

[Glen]

View attachment 7916414

How about a little real world data. Out of curiosity I went and set my truck up on this little hill on my property.

• Hand brake only with moderate pull of handle. Not a strong man pull as I am larger than most people.

In Neutral the truck easily rolled back down the hill and lurched to a stop.

• Transmission in park only

Truck moved slightly as I gently let off foot brake and transmission pawl engaged. Truck stayed solid and I was able to get out and take this pick. Great news is that shifting back into drive was pretty uneventful with only a slight objection by the pawl as it unlocked.

Long story short, use both if in doubt. But the transmission parking pawl is way more positive than the hand brake is and is not reliant on the user pulling hard enough.

For context this is an approximate 30 degree incline

Now get out from behind your keyboard and go try it for yourself and tell me I am wrong.

I tested my Grenny after posting, and if I select Neutral and turn the engine off, the transmission automatically selects Park. So hill-holding with the parking brake and the transmission in neutral requires leaving the engine on - yes?

 

[Glen]

What does this prove? That it held the one time you used it?

Use them both. It's why they exist and are legally required.

It shows the parking pawl contributes significant holding power by itself and that the parking brake contributes less than that. I’ve had similar experiences over many different vehicles.

And parking pawls aren’t required by law in the U. S. - they are just a common way to meet antitheft and rollaway requirements. Vehicles with manual transmissions don’t have a parking pawl - they rely on leaving the car in gear to supplement the holding power of the parking brake when necessary.

This discussion is not just pedantic. In Alaska - under certain conditions - using the parking brake (regardless of transmission type) can render the vehicle immovable for many days after the brake shoes/pads freeze to the drums/rotors. Sometimes you can break the frozen parts free (by attempting to move), sometimes not. I’ve had to resort to using another vehicle for a few days until the weather warms up or I could get a portable heater on the affected parts. Making this mistake in a remote area (I’ve been nearly 1,000 miles from help in the Yukon) could literally be fatal with unfavorable conditions. So knowing the characteristics and limitations of the parking brake and parking pawl is smart and not the irritating trivial discussion you might think it is.

 

[Dokatd]

I tested my Grenny after posting, and if I select Neutral and turn the engine off, the transmission automatically selects Park. So hill-holding with the parking brake and the transmission in neutral requires leaving the engine on - yes?

Yes, when working on Grenadiers in my shop I have to put the T-case in neutral to allow me to roll them by hand.

 

[Dokatd]

It shows the parking pawl contributes significant holding power by itself and that the parking brake contributes less than that. I’ve had similar experiences over many different vehicles.

And parking pawls aren’t required by law in the U. S. - they are just a common way to meet antitheft and rollaway requirements. Vehicles with manual transmissions don’t have a parking pawl - they rely on leaving the car in gear to supplement the holding power of the parking brake when necessary.

This discussion is not just pedantic. In Alaska - under certain conditions - using the parking brake (regardless of transmission type) can render the vehicle immovable for many days after the brake shoes/pads freeze to the drums/rotors. Sometimes you can break the frozen parts free (by attempting to move), sometimes not. I’ve had to resort to using another vehicle for a few days until the weather warms up or I could get a portable heater on the affected parts. Making this mistake in a remote area (I’ve been nearly 1,000 miles from help in the Yukon) could literally be fatal with unfavorable conditions. So knowing the characteristics and limitations of the parking brake and parking pawl is smart and not the irritating trivial discussion you might think it is.

Thank you for providing a solid regional explanation. I have experienced this even down in Texas. Not but 2-3 times, but it's happened in my driving career for sure. Just didn't think about it in this context.

As well, for those who scoff at how small parking pawls are, have you seen the swagged on clevis and pin that the parking brakes use? With both rear calipers converging into one cable with one small clevis. This is one place where context matters, even the smallest of parking pawl pins can hold more ultimate pressure than most parking brakes. As well both parking brakes and parking pawls can be reduced down to one potential failure point. That's why using both park position and park brake on inclines is important and that's what I do. But when you're parked up at Walmart you don't need the parking brake in the slightest. Save the cable wear for off-road or San Franciscos steep residential roads. as the parking pawl will engage regardless of what you do.

 

[landmannnn]

I tested my Grenny after posting, and if I select Neutral and turn the engine off, the transmission automatically selects Park. So hill-holding with the parking brake and the transmission in neutral requires leaving the engine on - yes?

Correct.
As I mentioned in a previous post, the pawl is normally engaged and only disengaged by hydraulic pressure from the auto trans.
So engine off, park is engaged.

 

[Happyoldgit]

In the UK vehicles at three years old have to undergo an inspection, or MOT test, and are then subject to the test annually. There are different classes of test depending on certain variables including weight. Vehicles over a certain age are now exempt from testing. Things like cars and light commercials are tested for functions of various systems, brakes included - as is the case"handbrake". The criteria for this test runs something along the lines of..

"The MOT brake test will check the efficiency of your handbrake, also called a parking brake. Efficiency refers to the effectiveness of the brake in holding the car stationary on an incline. If your parking brake efficiency is below the requirements (16% in the UK), it will result in an MOT fail"

 

[Dokatd]

In the UK vehicles at three years old have to undergo an inspection, or MOT test, and are then subject to the test annually. There are different classes of test depending on certain variables including weight. Vehicles over a certain age are now exempt from testing. Things like cars and light commercials are tested for functions of various systems, brakes included - as is the case"handbrake". The criteria for this test runs something along the lines of..

"The MOT brake test will check the efficiency of your handbrake, also called a parking brake. Efficiency refers to the effectiveness of the brake in holding the car stationary on an incline. If your parking brake efficiency is below the requirements (16% in the UK), it will result in an MOT fail"

That's similar to many states in the US. But nobody know how to check it. When I was a LR tech in the 90's we would verify the Parking Brake functioned by applying the brake fully and attempting to drive through it. If the torque converter stalled then the brake was ok.