Build date on website

[grenadierboy]

Thanks

 

[Davman]

You have selected Brighton I would assume?

 

[grenadierboy]

Yep.

Just called them.

The receptionist had never heard of INEOS Grenadier.

She put me on hold and asked the sales people in store.

No one has ever heard of the Grenadier.

I will call INEOS helpline now

 

[Davman]

OUCH.
Their website has a contact name and mobile number on it.
I have left messages, no response.

 

[grenadierboy]

Same.

The INEOS agency is part of the Brighton Nissan (which is part of Brighton Auto Group) but not Brighton Automotive Group!

The contact is Frank Sorentino.

I left him a voice message as he didn't pick up.

 

[Nick]

I have Brighton as my dealer
tried calling and texting Frank 3 times in 12 mths - always needed to leave message
said would get back with answer to question after speaking with Sydney - never a did
some dealers may not be enthusiastic as selling more than enough cars
anyway of changing dealers

 

[Davman]

I find the selection of "Agents/Dealers" a little strange I must admit.
Given that they have stuck with companies that mainly are already "car dealers", sort of defeats some of the reasons what made INEOS so attractive in the first place.
1/ If they are adopting a direct sale model, then you don't need the "traditional car dealer" for the sales process.
Initially INEOS (perhaps this was only IA UK) were saying that non traditional dealers would be chosen (agricultural stores etc etc), and that you would be able to get a car brought to you for a local test drive , by people who are enthusiasts themselves.

2/ They said from the outset that the major benefit of this vehicle was that you could service it yourself, and with open source service manuals, your local trusted mechanic could service it.
If this is the case, then you don't really need a car dealerships servicing department either - particularly since they were always going to add 3rd party service network like BOSCH as well.

They have generated all of this goodwill and interest in the Grenadier, which has generated a large group of enthusiasts already - only to then direct us to be dealt with by a group of people that by and large don't really care about the product, aren't 4x4 enthusiasts, and at the minute get more money in their pocket for selling a Honda Civic (Agency Model), or a Hyundai i30 (Dealer Model).

Obviously the "Dealers" have a lot to catch up on as far as knowledge goes, and they will get there - but I cannot see any bloke really getting passionate about the product, when they are just moving cars. This is a crying shame really.

I acknowledge there are guys out there like Stephen from Halliwell, and Warwick from SLR who are enthusiasts - I am not talking about these guys here - you are awesome.

 

[Michael H.]

I have just had a response from my dealer, Purnell Motors in Sydney. The dealer principal (Rodney) contacted me to advise that they are currently going through all of the training on a portal with INEOS and are almost ready to be switched over to live dealer. Once this is done they will have access to the same information that INEOS has including manufacturing schedules. What he did say that was very pleasing , was the INEOS are very committed to keeping the schedule on course for its current orders, with only minor changes. So expect your vehicle as previously communicated.
He also mentioned that the test drive vehicles are not far away and INEOS have insisted that ordered/ customers must be serviced first. He has advised that they will contact me shortly for test drive and a comprehensive vehicle review. Looks like the momentum is now starting to happen. The dealer was excellent with his information and very much said they are as excited about the Grenadier Journey as we are.

I have also had an enthusiastic reply from Rodney at Purnell Motors, which was very reassuring.

 

[grenadierboy]

I have Brighton as my dealer
tried calling and texting Frank 3 times in 12 mths - always needed to leave message
said would get back with answer to question after speaking with Sydney - never a did
some dealers may not be enthusiastic as selling more than enough cars
anyway of changing dealers

I will not cast any judgement yet on my limited dealings with Brighton Auto Group in Melbourne but, factually, after an initial 5 minute chat with Frank back in May (after my order) where he could not provide any insight whatsoever because he had not had any training - I have subsequently sent him 3 emails and left 2 voicemails since July and had no responses.

 

[Davman]

That's a real shame.
I think it was a bit the same with the other dealers, that early on they were a bit embarrassed that they didn't know much about it at all.

I think the Warragul guys are at least trying as best they can with the knowledge they have to help out. I have left them with a few questions to answer for me, so lets see how good they are I suppose.

 

[DaveB]

The guys at my dealer SLRV Expedition Vehicles on the Gold Coast have been great.
Friendly and interested on the phone.
I have started receiving emails from them.
They only sell specialised vehicles to a small number of clients though so not door slamming, tyre kicking car sales men

SLRV Expedition Vehicles and Luxury 4x4 Motorhomes

SLRV Expedition Vehicles and Luxury 4x4 Motorhomes boast incredible features and are purpose-built for the ultimate off-road traveller.

slrvexpedition.com.au

 

[grenadierboy]

So - I called Rex Gorell in Geelong and ask the person responsible for the INEOS agency to contact me.

5 minutes later Simon Favaloro at Rex Gorell Peugeot called me. Very proactive. I have changed my order to him.

Simon pretty much confirmed everything that Andy mentioned, including that those holding an order will receive their vehicle before dealers/agents can receive a stock of Grenadiers, excluding demo models. He thought it was more likely start of December before they had demo models. he said just over 2,000 people of Australia had paid/currently have the $800 reservation. Less than that have paid the full order deposit.

Regards the PTO versions currently doing the rounds in Australia, he doesn't know when they will be back in Victoria but he will advise me when they are scheduled down here.

 

[Davman]

Sounds much better.

The dealer I spoke to said that of the names they have on their books - about 85% have paid the $5000.

 

[Top Cat]

On your order there are various pieces of information that won't change and then their is one line that starts with the word Estimated.
That can/will change based on what configurations are ordered, their component availability and production scheduling.
I have no idea how far ahead they are locking in their production schedules, but I wouldn't think it would be more than a month ahead.
Most car manufacturers build for stock not against customer order. so the plan their production schedule and their dealers sell to the schedule.
When you go to a Toyota, Ford, Mazda etc dealer they look at a list of what they have in stock or they look at the factory allocated stock list.
The factory can do their schedules 6 months ahead or more.
Ineos will certainly need to batch build to orders with the same configurations such as paint, safari windows, etc.
At least until they start to build a history of common configurations.

View attachment 7794109

Hi Dave,
Just spoke to Paul, he is setting up the Adelaide showroom (sharing it with existing Porsche one!) and he advises he will be open for business with cars for show/demo December this year. I commented that the website is all sizzle and no sausage as it lacks what we as purchasers need to know going forward. he will be attending an Ineos workshop soon and will bring it up (hopefully!)
Tony, Adelaide South Australia

 

[Top Cat]

I have just had a response from my dealer, Purnell Motors in Sydney. The dealer principal (Rodney) contacted me to advise that they are currently going through all of the training on a portal with INEOS and are almost ready to be switched over to live dealer. Once this is done they will have access to the same information that INEOS has including manufacturing schedules. What he did say that was very pleasing , was the INEOS are very committed to keeping the schedule on course for its current orders, with only minor changes. So expect your vehicle as previously communicated.
He also mentioned that the test drive vehicles are not far away and INEOS have insisted that ordered/ customers must be serviced first. He has advised that they will contact me shortly for test drive and a comprehensive vehicle review. Looks like the momentum is now starting to happen. The dealer was excellent with his information and very much said they are as excited about the Grenadier Journey as we are.

Similar to what I have heard from the one and only Adelaide dealer. He is undergoing training, the showroom is being built on one of Adelaide higher end showroom sites with Porsche dealership. He is very keen to meet people who have ordered and has advised he will be processing those ordered vehicles as a priority. My first real conversation with a dealer so here's hoping
Tony

 

[DCPU]

I find the selection of "Agents/Dealers" a little strange I must admit.

I think the excellent high ideals for the project have not really materialised in full, at least so far. Perhaps, it was a little idealistic to think they would ~ and I very much wanted them too. However, INEOS have my full support (financial and otherwise) in trying this approach.

They have generated all of this goodwill and interest in the Grenadier, which has generated a large group of enthusiasts already - only to then direct us to be dealt with by a group of people that by and large don't really care about the product, aren't 4x4 enthusiasts, and at the minute get more money in their pocket for selling a Honda Civic (Agency Model), or a Hyundai i30 (Dealer Model).

I would agree with this, and extend it further. Ineos are recruiting across the board for all sorts of positions in Customer Service, Marketing, PR and Product Management. Almost exclusively they are appointing people who have worked for Audi, VW, Maclaren, Renault, etc.

I can only assume that the induction process has not included sitting down and understanding how this project came about and it's core ideals. What they are bringing to this project is their "expertise" in how Audi, VW, Maclaren, Renault did these tasks. The end result is the project ideals are getting watered down at best, or some lost at worst.

Go right back to the beginning of the project, Sir Jim tells the story of how Ineos sat down with various motor industry experts and laid out what they wanted to do. They were told it couldn't be done, so they recruited a team that had never worked a day in the motor industry, including a head designer who designed boats.

Obviously the "Dealers" have a lot to catch up on as far as knowledge goes, and they will get there - but I cannot see any bloke really getting passionate about the product, when they are just moving cars. This is a crying shame really.

What puzzles me is we have seen the photos of the retail partner conferences (at least 2 rounds in some regions) and global retail partner virtual conferences. So there's been opportunities for those who have wanted to step up to the plate and get right into the detail.

 

[DCPU]

Simon pretty much confirmed everything that Andy mentioned, including that those holding an order will receive their vehicle before dealers/agents can receive a stock of Grenadiers, excluding demo models.

Is that a change - are "dealers/agents" actually going to hold stock? I though the sales model was that all sales would be direct through Ineos?

 

[aylestage]

I have just spoken with Ineos UK as when i last spoke with them they advised i would be asked to sign a contract in a few days. I didn't hear anything so decided to call them. The advisor said that the OCT builds were not going to happen due to world part shortages. When asked when the new build date was expected, she stated they didn't have one yet. At least they are consistent ... They miss every date they issue!

 

[emax]

Dealers can not use cars for test drives if they were build to orders. So the only way to get to test cars is to have them 'on stock'.

 

[aylestage]

Is that a change - are "dealers/agents" actually going to hold stock? I though the sales model was that all sales would be direct through Ineos?

UK dealers have ordered vehicles for demo use (seems to be 2 or 3 a dealership) my dealer had a meeting on the 16th SEPT and they were told at that point, they would see their demos in OCT. But with the first batch of vehicles build date moving back from OCT I am not sure they will be seeing them just yet