UK Servicing or lack of!!!!

[Eric]

Ineos has a tough task ahead in the uk getting dealer / service network in place, whoever takes on the task is going to want a return on their investment.
You only need to ask yourself how many do you see on the road daily, for me I know there are not enough vehicles locally ( South Coast) to warrant a dealer or service agent, which is disappointing.

It is going to be a dealer that adds it to an existing brand, as a supplement not sole source income. Personally I'd have thought BMW dealers to be well placed

 

[NQ94]

Reading between the lines from my conversations with the CEO, they are not just going to jump into bed with the first dealership who wants to sell Grenadiers. I think they have a fairly robust vetting procedure.

There would be similar robust vetting procedures from the dealerships. Ineos would have to do some pretty hard selling to convince large dealers that their investment in the brand will pay off.

 

[Tom D]

There would be similar robust vetting procedures from the dealerships. Ineos would have to do some pretty hard selling to convince large dealers that their investment in the brand will pay off.

I have thought about that, Usually a new dealership will spend a lot on re-branding the premises. They'd need to sell quite a few cars to make it back.

 

[DoubleDoom]

It is going to be a dealer that adds it to an existing brand, as a supplement not sole source income. Personally I'd have thought BMW dealers to be well placed

I agree. In our area, the agent is changing (or has already changed) to the dealer model. However, some years ago, they moved their main dealerships (which they have a number of brands) into a selection of more modern units. Rather than close their old ones, they used repurposed them for smaller brands, used vehicles etc. They used one of their older Ford outlets for Ineos. However, the dealer also uses the same site for other jobs. So, they can retail and service IGs but also pick up the slack in other ways. The only thing I fear for that site is housing. New builds have been heading in that direction for many years and a couple of years ago, the location became surrounded with new builds to the side and rear.

The dealer model will mean that warranty work will be more lucrative to them compared to agent model.

 

[NQ94]

I have thought about that, Usually a new dealership will spend a lot on re-branding the premises. They'd need to sell quite a few cars to make it back.

Branding and sales training would be the cheapest part. Just supporting the brand is one of the biggest expenses. The technical training for techs, diagnostic licenses and the tooling to carry out repairs are a big commitment. Most OEM courses I have attended for fleets and while working for an OEM cost around Au$1 to 2k per person for a basic three or four day familiarisation and basic diagnostic course plus the same again for the specialised advance repair and overhaul courses plus techs labour and lost workshop revenue. The access to OEM diagnostics for each computer or device, manuals and parts catalogue subscriptions are a huge annual expense. Not even what people think are OEM owned dealers are immune from these expenses. Having enough cars to repair and service to offset the hidden expenses to deliver quality work and keep reputation would be a big concern for any dealer committing to or staying with a new brand.

 

[ECrider]

The weight of the vehicle also demands heavy duty lifts. One reason why Adventure Auto cannot service the cars at their Oxford branch is that their lifts there are not rated for the weight of our trucks. Think they are max 3 ton and H&S demand min 5t. So most car focused service sites cannot legally get the buggers in the air. More expense and/or restrictive options.

 

[Logsplitter]

The weight of the vehicle also demands heavy duty lifts. One reason why Adventure Auto cannot service the cars at their Oxford branch is that their lifts there are not rated for the weight of our trucks. Think they are max 3 ton and H&S demand min 5t. So most car focused service sites cannot legally get the buggers in the air. More expense and/or restrictive options.

Hence why Ineos should be working with established agricultural and 4x4 service agents

 

[Motorvat]

It is going to be a dealer that adds it to an existing brand, as a supplement not sole source income. Personally I'd have thought BMW dealers to be . My understanding is that Northampton and Oxford now have only one technician. As Endeavour have closed I believe this is the only technician in the south east between Birmingham and the

south coast
If INEOS have a restructuring plan it would be helpful for both current and future owners if they would share the details
I actually don’t see this as a dealer problem they are working hard ,it is the direction
and support from INEOS that has created
this shambles
If INEOS ever issue a manual and diagnostic tools hopefully they will also issue warranty claim forms so we can organise our own warranty claims

 

[Eric]

south coast
If INEOS have a restructuring plan it would be helpful for both current and future owners if they would share the details
I actually don’t see this as a dealer problem they are working hard ,it is the direction
and support from INEOS that has created
this shambles
If INEOS ever issue a manual and diagnostic tools hopefully they will also issue warranty claim forms so we can organise our own warranty claims

It's a dealer problem, if they aren't selling new vehicles, profit gone; warranty work fix price costs set by Ineos, minor profit margin and c) there are not enough vehicles out there yet to make a living on chargeable service work.

 

[ECrider]

It's a dealer problem, if they aren't selling new vehicles, profit gone; warranty work fix price costs set by Ineos, minor profit margin and c) there are not enough vehicles out there yet to make a living on chargeable service work.

One of the warranty work grumbles I heard was that Ineos allocated a certain labour time for each element changed, i.e axle change - 4hrs labour due from IA. The grumble from the workshop was, 4hrs perhaps to install all parts etc on an assembly line but it takes us double that on a fully assembled car....!

Basically being allotted half time on warranty work.

Pulled numbers out of a hat but you get the jist.

 

[Eric]

One of the warranty work grumbles I heard was that Ineos allocated a certain labour time for each element changed, i.e axle change - 4hrs labour due from IA. The grumble from the workshop was, 4hrs perhaps to install all parts etc on an assembly line but it takes us double that on a fully assembled car....!

Basically being allotted half time on warranty work.

Pulled numbers out of a hat but you get the jist.

It is the same with must vehicle manufacturers these days, there is very little, and sometimes a loss, of profit in warranty work.

 

[Commodore]

I have a few common issues to discuss with her, this is one of them.

Did the drive shaft let go completely? any other damage?

Tom, Is the front driveshaft Rzeppa joint (aka CV) on your list of things to take to Lynn about? Mine was replace last week at 12,000 miles and I don't have a lift. That joint is definitely a problem and desperately needs to be re-engineered before someone is hurt. If it lets go on the highway you are going to lose forward propulsion at a bad time not to mention that it is going to be bashing around under the car. They need to actually jump on this as it is a legit safety concern.

 

[Tom D]

It would be handy to know how many have let go completely flailing around, and how many have torn the boot lost grease and worn prematurely?

I know that some of the ones that had let go were due to a faulty or misaligned circlip on the end of the shaft..

 

[landmannnn]

It is the same with must vehicle manufacturers these days, there is very little, and sometimes a loss, of profit in warranty work.

My heart doesn't bleed for the dealers, considering the extortionate hourly rate they charge us.

 

[Eric]

My heart doesn't bleed for the dealers, considering the extortionate hourly rate they charge us.

To be honest, I have sympathy for major dealers. Sites in prime locations, high business rates, sales staff, IT systems, websites, accounts depts, spare depts, reception staff, car valeting, free courtesy car courtesy coffee and biscuits etc etc, it all mounts up building the overheads. That have to be recovered in charge out rates.
The wife's car, well out of warranty is serviced by a bus/ coach company that use the mechanics, sorry technicians, down time from maintaining the bus fleet, to servicing private cars. They are cheaper because their overheads are covered by the core business, and don't give me coffee and biscuits nor a free loan car.

 

[landmannnn]

To be honest, I have sympathy for major dealers. Sites in prime locations, high business rates, sales staff, IT systems, websites, accounts depts, spare depts, reception staff, car valeting, free courtesy car courtesy coffee and biscuits etc etc, it all mounts up building the overheads. That have to be recovered in charge out rates.
The wife's car, well out of warranty is serviced by a bus/ coach company that use the mechanics, sorry technicians, down time from maintaining the bus fleet, to servicing private cars. They are cheaper because their overheads are covered by the core business, and don't give me coffee and biscuits nor a free loan car.

While not disagreeing, the main dealer workshops are their major profit centres, accounting for around 60% of their gross profits.

Many of us are forced to use them to keep all of our warranties intact. You must use them to keep your paint warranty for example. For IA you must use them to turn off that reminder (I guess deliberately)

So as per your example above, the workshop is the core business which covers the overheads.