Station wagon vs. commercial versions

[rovie]

Not Germany:
„On Sundays and public holidays, trucks with a permissible total weight of more than 7.5 t are not allowed to drive between midnight and 10 p.m. The driving ban on Sundays and public holidays only applies to commercial goods traffic. This means: If the truck has a permissible total weight of 7.5 t or less, then it does not even come under the Sunday and public holiday driving ban.
If it is heavier or you are driving with a trailer (the weight of the combination is irrelevant), then the purpose of the journey is decisive. If the purpose of the trip is not to transport goods for commercial purposes, then you may drive without restrictions on Sundays and public holidays. So you can go on holiday with your caravan or mobile home without hesitation. Participation in private events (e.g. trucker, vintage car meeting) is also possible without any problems.“ (ADAC)

No question. For private purposes, that's true. But I am talking about commercial use. The fact that people exploit the commercial registration for private purposes is another matter.

 

[emax]

Commercial registration is required by law for a particular model. When someone buys such a model, he gets a (fiscal) commercial registration, whether he wants it or not. This has nothing to do with "exploitation":

Halter von Fahrzeugen wie z. B. Kleinbusse, die als Lkw zugelassen sind, standen immer wieder vor der Frage, wie die Kfz-Steuer bei diesen Fahrzeugen zu berechnen ist. Diese Frage ist jetzt geklärt.

• Neu: nur die Eintragung in den Fahrzeugpapieren ist für die Steuer entscheidend
• bislang war auch Pkw-Besteuerung möglich, da die Eintragung nicht allein maßgebend war
• Änderung des Kfz-Steuergesetzes seit 23.10.2020 in Kraft

Aufgrund einer Sonderregel im Kraftfahrzeugsteuergesetz bestand bislang das Problem, dass nicht allein die Zulassung entscheidend war. Das hat sich zum 23.10.2020 geändert.

Source: https://www.adac.de/rund-ums-fahrzeug/auto-kaufen-verkaufen/kfz-steuer/lkw-zulassung/

 

[DaveB]

Not Germany:
„On Sundays and public holidays, trucks with a permissible total weight of more than 7.5 t are not allowed to drive between midnight and 10 p.m. The driving ban on Sundays and public holidays only applies to commercial goods traffic. This means: If the truck has a permissible total weight of 7.5 t or less, then it does not even come under the Sunday and public holiday driving ban.
If it is heavier or you are driving with a trailer (the weight of the combination is irrelevant), then the purpose of the journey is decisive. If the purpose of the trip is not to transport goods for commercial purposes, then you may drive without restrictions on Sundays and public holidays. So you can go on holiday with your caravan or mobile home without hesitation. Participation in private events (e.g. trucker, vintage car meeting) is also possible without any problems.“ (ADAC)

You guys from Germany need to relocate to somewhere happier. I love my visits to Germany, and my German friends, but you have too many rules. We will probably be in the same place in 20-30 years time but that will not bother me.

 

[emax]

You're right. We've already looked for an island (not kidding, but just out of cursiosity). There are some. Perfect for off roading. But no restaurants, doctors, hospitals, malls, petrol stations.

• I considered northern Italy, but the rules are even worse. The good thing however: Nobody cares.
• Southern England was an idea. Like in Italy, I speak the language. But they drive on the wrong side of the street.
• Southern France? Not bad, but too many French.
• Switzerland: fantastic for people with a job. Way too expensive for pensioners.
• Norway, Sweden: Beautiful countries, perfect for off roading. But zillions of mosquitos and too cold. No cash paying. Expensive beer.

Greece?
Panama?
Canada?
...

Ideas, anybody?

 

[Greg]

North Queensland, Australia.
We almost speak english over here.
We have lots of retired folk and plenty of places to drive.

 

[emax]

Very far away from home. Might be a nice place to live, but I don't know enough about it.

 

[DaveB]

Very far away from home. Might be a nice place to live, but I don't know enough about it.

Weather is mostly good
Shoes are optional
Suits are not required.
Friendliness is compulsory.
If you go for a walk leave your watch at home, you will stop and talk to neighbours often.
Food and drink are plentiful and shared.

 

[ECrider]

+1 for Greece, the food is very good, the wine has become excellent. Unfortunately a pain to get anything 'official' done but like Italy most've them do what they think is right anyway. Great weather and plenty of variety from north to south, islands to mainland. Woke seems yet to be a 'thing' there which is nice.

 

[ECrider]

oh, and the beaches always have good 'views'

 

[bemax]

You're right. We've already looked for an island (not kidding, but just out of cursiosity). There are some. Perfect for off roading. But no restaurants, doctors, hospitals, malls, petrol stations.

• I considered northern Italy, but the rules are even worse. The good thing however: Nobody cares.
• Southern England was an idea. Like in Italy, I speak the language. But they drive on the wrong side of the street.
• Southern France? Not bad, but too many French.
• Switzerland: fantastic for people with a job. Way too expensive for pensioners.
• Norway, Sweden: Beautiful countries, perfect for off roading. But zillions of mosquitos and too cold. No cash paying. Expensive beer.

Greece?
Panama?
Canada?
...

Ideas, anybody?

Have a look here

https://www.vladi-private-islands.de/de/

 

[emax]

All nice places to be - for a while. But for the rest of my life?

Being conservative in my decisions and having some life experience, I also try to consider political, health, safety and other aspects. For example, the islands mentioned above are prone to flooding in some unknown distant future.

And I would never emigrate to a Muslim country either. Countries with high inflation rates are also potentially dangerous simply because they are unstable (Germany ... ?).

One should be able to live there without heating. You should be allowed to drill your own well, and the country should be as independent as possible from food imports.

Brazil has a lot of that. But politically it is a troubled country and there is poverty. And that's always a danger: Whoever promises the poor to solve all their problems will be elected - even if they are socialists. And the language, Portuguese, is a real problem.

Another thing is crime.

If I had a solution, I would already be gone.

 

[rovie]

Commercial registration is required by law for a particular model. When someone buys such a model, he gets a (fiscal) commercial registration, whether he wants it or not. This has nothing to do with "exploitation":



Source: https://www.adac.de/rund-ums-fahrzeug/auto-kaufen-verkaufen/kfz-steuer/lkw-zulassung/

I mean those who modify their station wagon or off-road vehicle in such a way that they obtain commercial registration in order to reduce vehicle tax. For example, by replacing the rear side windows with sheet metal or removing the rear seat and seat belts. There are enough Defenders that have commercial vehicle registration. They could just as easily register their vehicle as a passenger car.
Now don't tell me they don't want to get a tax break.

 

[emax]

> replacing the rear side windows with sheet metal
Doesn't change the registration. Commercial registration is then still valid.

> or removing the rear seat and seat belts.
Doesn't change the registration. Commercial registration is then still valid.

> They could just as easily register their vehicle as a passenger car.
As I have shown above: They have no influence on the type of registration.

 

[globalgregors]

You're right. We've already looked for an island (not kidding, but just out of cursiosity). There are some. Perfect for off roading. But no restaurants, doctors, hospitals, malls, petrol stations.

• I considered northern Italy, but the rules are even worse. The good thing however: Nobody cares.
• Southern England was an idea. Like in Italy, I speak the language. But they drive on the wrong side of the street.
• Southern France? Not bad, but too many French.
• Switzerland: fantastic for people with a job. Way too expensive for pensioners.
• Norway, Sweden: Beautiful countries, perfect for off roading. But zillions of mosquitos and too cold. No cash paying. Expensive beer.

Greece?
Panama?
Canada?
...

Ideas, anybody?

Have you headed east, @emax? Croatia, Slovakia, Romania, Turkey, Georgia… all worth a look. Georgia (Caucasus Mountains) maybe the most epic of that list for 4wding, excellent food and something like 8,000 years of winemaking. What could go wrong?

 

[emax]

Great sites there. But as I have already written, it is about more. At the age of 65 I feel more comfortable with a functioning health care ;-)

 

[ECrider]

Cuba!!!

 

[emax]

Good drinks. Good music. Nice, äh, people ...

 

[ECrider]

good ballet and surgeons- superior smokes

 

[rovie]

> replacing the rear side windows with sheet metal
Doesn't change the registration. Commercial registration is then still valid.

> or removing the rear seat and seat belts.
Doesn't change the registration. Commercial registration is then still valid.

> They could just as easily register their vehicle as a passenger car.
As I have shown above: They have no influence on the type of registration.

Stu has once again summarised rules of conduct for us in the forum. I can only support these and of course behave in the same way.

Emax, you have your opinion, which I respect, and I have my experience, which I have been happy to pass on to this forum so far.
In forums, including here, there are opinions that are not based on facts, but are formed from various sources of information. Sometimes things are not presented or interpreted correctly due to lack of knowledge.
Please excuse me for saying this, but your way of phrasing comes across to me as very lecturing. Comparable to a cashier in a supermarket who is told that she has to weigh the strawberries packed in a plastic bowl without the packaging, with the teaching "never heard of tara?". I wonder what type of person would do that?

However, since everyone here is reading along, I would like to make it clear that there are indeed vehicles that, due to their type of construction, can be registered both as commercial vehicles and as passenger cars in the vehicle documents. Corresponding modifications must be made to the vehicles and approved by a technical inspection agency. Accordingly, the different taxation takes place.

I will end the discussion on this topic herewith and in the future will present things objectively based on personal experience and knowledge, as I have done in the past. All other statements are my personal opinions, just as you have yours.

 

[emax]

I apologize if my answer came across that way.

However, I had provided a source, namely the ADAC, which can undoubtedly be considered a competent source for the topic. In a case like this, when I receive a response that seem to simply ignore a well-researched fact or don't even relate to the answer in the slightest, I keep my answer brief as I don't want to bore or intrude on anyone.

You correctly noted that this was such a response, but it was for a reason.

It is nothing personal, but just a viable way for me to control my anger and remain factual. And I would like to keep it that way in the future, because it is simply correct from my point of view.