Grenadier Alternatives (Australia)

[SirJimR]

Hi all, thought it would be fun to put up some competitor vehicles that I considered before pulling the trigger on my order.
I'll list some Pros & Cons, as well as a link to the specs on CarsGuide for each.

Essentially - I chose the Grenadier because it takes the best of the below and combines it into a cohesive package that does it all and better.

2023 Jeep Wrangler Rubicon:
https://www.carsguide.com.au/jeep/wrangler/2023
Pro: Cheaper than Grenadier
Pro: Large existing dealer network
Pro: ZF gearbox
Pro: More flexibility with removable roof
Pro: More modern appointments
Con: Petrol only
Con: Jeep reliability
Con: Historical Jeep Australia service is atrocious
Con: 2.5t towing capacity

2023 Toyota Landcruiser 70 Series LC78 GXL (wagon):
https://www.carsguide.com.au/toyota/landcruiser-70-series/price/2023
Pro: Cheaper list price than Grenadier
Con: Dealer markup makes it far more expensive than Grenadier
Pro: Toyota reliability
Pro: Large existing dealer network
Pro: 3.5t towing capacity
Con: Lower GVM than Grenadier
Con: Manual transmission only
Con: V8 Diesel only (thirsty)
Con: Very basic interior
Con: Long waiting list

2023 Toyota Landcruiser LC300 Sahara 4x4
https://www.carsguide.com.au/toyota/landcruiser/price/2023/lc300-sahara-4x4?id=zIjWQlDM
Pro: Toyota reliability
Pro: Large existing dealer network
Con: More expensive list price than Grenadier
Con: Long waiting list
Pro: Economical twin turbo V6 diesel
Pro: 80L fuel tank + 30L reserve tank
Pro: 3.5t towing capacity
Con: Over reliance on electrical systems (adaptive cruise, lane keep etc)
Con: Cheap feeling interior for the money
Con: Double wishbone/independent front suspension

2023 Mercedes-Benz G Class G63
https://www.carsguide.com.au/mercedes-benz/g-class/price/2023/g63?id=zIzRUJEM
Con: Only AMG G63 variant available in Australia as new car
Pro: G-Wagen history & pedigree
Pro: AMG V8 performance
Pro: 3.5t towing capacity
Con: Over $350k list price
Con: Thirsty V8 petrol engine
Con: Not a proper off roader in the AMG spec, just a Chelsea tractor
Con: Way too much of a reliance on electrical systems

2020 Mercedes-Benz G-Class G300 CDI Professional (Wagon):
https://www.carsguide.com.au/mercedes-benz/g-class/price/2020/g300-cdi-professional-awd?id=wIzVaBDM
Con: No longer available new
Con: Only 2 years left on Mercedes warranty
Con: Buying a used car - Buyer beware
Con: Used car for new car price tag
Con: 3.2t towing capacity
Pro: Legendary offroad pedigree
Pro: Used by Australian Defence Force, so parts will be readily available for many years to come
Pro: Similar design philosophy to Grenadier
Pro: Washable interior
Pro: Minimal electrics so not much to go wrong
Con: Very basic interior - even compared to LC78

2023 Nissan Patrol Ti-L 4x4 Y62
https://www.carsguide.com.au/nissan/patrol/price/2023/ti-l-4x4?id=zIzMPFEM
Pro: Nissan reliability
Pro: Large existing dealer network
Con: More expensive list price than Grenadier
Con: V8 Petrol only - thirsty
Con: Very basic outdated interior for the money - LC300 is better
Con: Over reliance on electrical systems (adaptive cruise, lane keep etc)
Pro: Same GCM as Grenadier
Con: Lower GVM
Pro: 3.5t towing capacity

2023 Mahindra Pik-Up S11 4x4 Dual Cab
https://www.carsguide.com.au/mahindra/pik-up/price/2023/s11-4x4?id=zIzNINEM
Pro: Wildcard with a cult following like Grenadier
Pro: Reliable, sturdy vehicle
Pro: Landcruiser for a fraction of the price
Pro: Aisin 6 speed auto
Pro: Apple CarPlay & Android Auto - pretty sure LC78 doesn't have this
Pro: Proper offroader
Con: 2.5t towing capacity
Con: Leaf springs
Con: Mahindra dealer network isn't huge
Con: Interior feels cheap - some of the Chinese utes feel more premium for less money
Con: Ute - I'd prefer a wagon
Con: Not a huge amount of aftermarket accessories out (yet)

 

[Mtnranger]

Con: Manual transmission only

Sir, that’s not a con

 

[SirJimR]

Sir, that’s not a con

It is when your partner can't drive manual & it's a shared car

 

[Tazzieman]

Very comprehensive comparison list.
I sort of had a glance around and went yeah nah yeah nah...Oh , there's a Grenadier to be had.
Like it , charge it!
But don't call me impulsive.

 

[AnD3rew]

Pretty accurate I would say. Makes the Grenadier a bit of a no brainer really

 

[DDG]

Really great list. Well thought out. Seems like a 70 Series LC is a sweet spot. Why wouldn’t Toyota build as many of these as they could? Seems like a license to print money. The idea that the perfect 4x4 has already been made. We just need a never ending supply of them. It’s the Porsche 911 concept. Stop all the regulations and requirements and just evolve the Land Cruiser endlessly

 

[Steve.B]

With the demise of the G Professional there are no equally robust alternatives, the Y61 would have been the closest, now the closest would be the Y62 but a different vehicle really, and if Toyota spent more money on development and engineering and less on advertising, the reliability myth might actually be real. For instance the 79 series gearbox is fragile, you can't tow in 5th gear, it has the same front diff centre as a Hilux plus all the design flaws like the narrow rear track, its starter motor is under the inlet manifold in the V, creating a water trap, and it takes 2 days work to change the starter motor. ( good luck doing that in the bush ).
The 200 series has the same starter motor, but it is automatic, so no ability to push start.
The 300 series has a hot V design,( 2 Turbo chargers in the V ) massive heat with nowhere to escape, towing in a hot climate like Australia, good luck with that, I could only imagine how brittle the gaskets will get over time and how hard it would be to keep things lubricated in the top end with all that heat, lots of wear.

 

[grenadierboy]

Forget the Toyota LC 300 - what I would is a Toyota Mega Cruiser from the 1990's

A bit disappointing in the looks dept. - it had a 4 liter diesel, triple lockers & 4 wheel steering - not bad in it's day.

I believe one or two of them made it to Australia although I have not seen one personally.

 

[DaveB]

Really great list. Well thought out. Seems like a 70 Series LC is a sweet spot. Why wouldn’t Toyota build as many of these as they could? Seems like a license to print money. The idea that the perfect 4x4 has already been made. We just need a never ending supply of them. It’s the Porsche 911 concept. Stop all the regulations and requirements and just evolve the Land Cruiser endlessly

If you can get a 70 series you then need to spend another $100,000 on it to make it liveable
I know people who have spent more than $250,000 on one.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yb_utkJS3eU

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DBpRLpAWB5M

 

[Rok_Dr]

That's a great summary @SirJimR. Thank you for posting. I did have a giggle about the Mahindra as Magic, the Ineos dealer in Perth, is also the Mahindra dealer and both showrooms are side by side.

I too went through a similar exercise earlier in the year when I was considering bailing out. I took a more "rivet counter approach" and compiled the attached spreadsheet. I only compared station wagons and to the extent possible picked the most comparable models to the Trialmaster which I had ordered (LC300 excepted). I didn't attempt to price in manufacturer supplied accessories or consider after market ones, but that would change the prices markedly if I was getting everything to the same spec.

My headline conclusions:

• If you want out of the box range go Toyota. But I think real world fuel consumption figures will change the table order significantly and I suspect that Toyota are a tad optimistic with their official consumption figures.
• The Wrangler is clearly a different beast and targeted to the technical recreational market rather than long distance touring, towing and commercial ones.
• If I was budget constrained I'd get a Prado and accept the clearance/angle limitations.
• The Everest betrays its dual cab ute heritage and marketing spin with limited payload at max tow wt.
• Though a petrol the Nissan Patrol doesn't stack up too badly by the numbers.
• Ultimately it confirmed that the Grenadier, out of the box, best matched what i was looking for in a new car to replace my Discovery 2.

Cheers
Steve

 

[Shorty]

Does Toyota Prado not come in for consideration?

 

[Rok_Dr]

Does Toyota Prado not come in for consideration?

Hi @Shorty. Nice to see a familiar name on this forum!

Yes the Prado is in the table and would have been my budget option. Ultimately not as capable off road or as well built but enough towing capacity for Banjo.

Cheers
Steve

 

[Geordie Hillbilly]

Hi all, thought it would be fun to put up some competitor vehicles that I considered before pulling the trigger on my order.
I'll list some Pros & Cons, as well as a link to the specs on CarsGuide for each.

Essentially - I chose the Grenadier because it takes the best of the below and combines it into a cohesive package that does it all and better.

2023 Jeep Wrangler Rubicon:
https://www.carsguide.com.au/jeep/wrangler/2023
Pro: Cheaper than Grenadier
Pro: Large existing dealer network
Pro: ZF gearbox
Pro: More flexibility with removable roof
Pro: More modern appointments
Con: Petrol only
Con: Jeep reliability
Con: Historical Jeep Australia service is atrocious
Con: 2.5t towing capacity

2023 Toyota Landcruiser 70 Series LC78 GXL (wagon):
https://www.carsguide.com.au/toyota/landcruiser-70-series/price/2023
Pro: Cheaper list price than Grenadier
Con: Dealer markup makes it far more expensive than Grenadier
Pro: Toyota reliability
Pro: Large existing dealer network
Pro: 3.5t towing capacity
Con: Lower GVM than Grenadier
Con: Manual transmission only
Con: V8 Diesel only (thirsty)
Con: Very basic interior
Con: Long waiting list

2023 Toyota Landcruiser LC300 Sahara 4x4
https://www.carsguide.com.au/toyota/landcruiser/price/2023/lc300-sahara-4x4?id=zIjWQlDM
Pro: Toyota reliability
Pro: Large existing dealer network
Con: More expensive list price than Grenadier
Con: Long waiting list
Pro: Economical twin turbo V6 diesel
Pro: 80L fuel tank + 30L reserve tank
Pro: 3.5t towing capacity
Con: Over reliance on electrical systems (adaptive cruise, lane keep etc)
Con: Cheap feeling interior for the money
Con: Double wishbone/independent front suspension

2023 Mercedes-Benz G Class G63
https://www.carsguide.com.au/mercedes-benz/g-class/price/2023/g63?id=zIzRUJEM
Con: Only AMG G63 variant available in Australia as new car
Pro: G-Wagen history & pedigree
Pro: AMG V8 performance
Pro: 3.5t towing capacity
Con: Over $350k list price
Con: Thirsty V8 petrol engine
Con: Not a proper off roader in the AMG spec, just a Chelsea tractor
Con: Way too much of a reliance on electrical systems

2020 Mercedes-Benz G-Class G300 CDI Professional (Wagon):
https://www.carsguide.com.au/mercedes-benz/g-class/price/2020/g300-cdi-professional-awd?id=wIzVaBDM
Con: No longer available new
Con: Only 2 years left on Mercedes warranty
Con: Buying a used car - Buyer beware
Con: Used car for new car price tag
Con: 3.2t towing capacity
Pro: Legendary offroad pedigree
Pro: Used by Australian Defence Force, so parts will be readily available for many years to come
Pro: Similar design philosophy to Grenadier
Pro: Washable interior
Pro: Minimal electrics so not much to go wrong
Con: Very basic interior - even compared to LC78

2023 Nissan Patrol Ti-L 4x4 Y62
https://www.carsguide.com.au/nissan/patrol/price/2023/ti-l-4x4?id=zIzMPFEM
Pro: Nissan reliability
Pro: Large existing dealer network
Con: More expensive list price than Grenadier
Con: V8 Petrol only - thirsty
Con: Very basic outdated interior for the money - LC300 is better
Con: Over reliance on electrical systems (adaptive cruise, lane keep etc)
Pro: Same GCM as Grenadier
Con: Lower GVM
Pro: 3.5t towing capacity

2023 Mahindra Pik-Up S11 4x4 Dual Cab
https://www.carsguide.com.au/mahindra/pik-up/price/2023/s11-4x4?id=zIzNINEM
Pro: Wildcard with a cult following like Grenadier
Pro: Reliable, sturdy vehicle
Pro: Landcruiser for a fraction of the price
Pro: Aisin 6 speed auto
Pro: Apple CarPlay & Android Auto - pretty sure LC78 doesn't have this
Pro: Proper offroader
Con: 2.5t towing capacity
Con: Leaf springs
Con: Mahindra dealer network isn't huge
Con: Interior feels cheap - some of the Chinese utes feel more premium for less money
Con: Ute - I'd prefer a wagon
Con: Not a huge amount of aftermarket accessories out (yet)

The Mahindra is the ugliest looking car I think I have ever seen!

 

[trobex]

Y62 for a comparator. LC300 GR is you have 150k spare but direct problems with the LC300 as some are reporting. There is no real competitor I think at 107k...

 

[SirJimR]

The Mahindra is the ugliest looking car I think I have ever seen!

All new BMW’s would disagree with you

 

[SirJimR]

Does Toyota Prado not come in for consideration?

For me? No.
Reasons:
Weedy 4 cyl engine
3t towing capacity (and with a 4cyl that’s a stretch)
Less than 3t gvm
Double wishbone torsion bar suspension
Like the lc300 the interior just feels “cheap” for what you’re paying. Lots of hard plastics and rattles

 

[Tomato]

Good summary of comparisons, I lived in AUS for 5 years. I ran a 2003 facelift V8 Disco 2 there. No problems except it was misbuilt, thirsty and just over 2 metres high with the chunky roof bars

Deal breakers for me:

1. Anything that isnt permanent 4wd. Part time 4wd's are part time because it's cheaper to build.
2. Anything manual - even the Australian Army run auto G wagons
3. Anything I dont fit in ( Old Defender, 70 series)
4. Anything without diff lock(s)

 

[bemax]

Hi all, thought it would be fun to put up some competitor vehicles that I considered before pulling the trigger on my order.
I'll list some Pros & Cons, as well as a link to the specs on CarsGuide for each.

Essentially - I chose the Grenadier because it takes the best of the below and combines it into a cohesive package that does it all and better.

2023 Jeep Wrangler Rubicon:
https://www.carsguide.com.au/jeep/wrangler/2023
Pro: Cheaper than Grenadier
Pro: Large existing dealer network
Pro: ZF gearbox
Pro: More flexibility with removable roof
Pro: More modern appointments
Con: Petrol only
Con: Jeep reliability
Con: Historical Jeep Australia service is atrocious
Con: 2.5t towing capacity

2023 Toyota Landcruiser 70 Series LC78 GXL (wagon):
https://www.carsguide.com.au/toyota/landcruiser-70-series/price/2023
Pro: Cheaper list price than Grenadier
Con: Dealer markup makes it far more expensive than Grenadier
Pro: Toyota reliability
Pro: Large existing dealer network
Pro: 3.5t towing capacity
Con: Lower GVM than Grenadier
Con: Manual transmission only
Con: V8 Diesel only (thirsty)
Con: Very basic interior
Con: Long waiting list

2023 Toyota Landcruiser LC300 Sahara 4x4
https://www.carsguide.com.au/toyota/landcruiser/price/2023/lc300-sahara-4x4?id=zIjWQlDM
Pro: Toyota reliability
Pro: Large existing dealer network
Con: More expensive list price than Grenadier
Con: Long waiting list
Pro: Economical twin turbo V6 diesel
Pro: 80L fuel tank + 30L reserve tank
Pro: 3.5t towing capacity
Con: Over reliance on electrical systems (adaptive cruise, lane keep etc)
Con: Cheap feeling interior for the money
Con: Double wishbone/independent front suspension

2023 Mercedes-Benz G Class G63
https://www.carsguide.com.au/mercedes-benz/g-class/price/2023/g63?id=zIzRUJEM
Con: Only AMG G63 variant available in Australia as new car
Pro: G-Wagen history & pedigree
Pro: AMG V8 performance
Pro: 3.5t towing capacity
Con: Over $350k list price
Con: Thirsty V8 petrol engine
Con: Not a proper off roader in the AMG spec, just a Chelsea tractor
Con: Way too much of a reliance on electrical systems

2020 Mercedes-Benz G-Class G300 CDI Professional (Wagon):
https://www.carsguide.com.au/mercedes-benz/g-class/price/2020/g300-cdi-professional-awd?id=wIzVaBDM
Con: No longer available new
Con: Only 2 years left on Mercedes warranty
Con: Buying a used car - Buyer beware
Con: Used car for new car price tag
Con: 3.2t towing capacity
Pro: Legendary offroad pedigree
Pro: Used by Australian Defence Force, so parts will be readily available for many years to come
Pro: Similar design philosophy to Grenadier
Pro: Washable interior
Pro: Minimal electrics so not much to go wrong
Con: Very basic interior - even compared to LC78

2023 Nissan Patrol Ti-L 4x4 Y62
https://www.carsguide.com.au/nissan/patrol/price/2023/ti-l-4x4?id=zIzMPFEM
Pro: Nissan reliability
Pro: Large existing dealer network
Con: More expensive list price than Grenadier
Con: V8 Petrol only - thirsty
Con: Very basic outdated interior for the money - LC300 is better
Con: Over reliance on electrical systems (adaptive cruise, lane keep etc)
Pro: Same GCM as Grenadier
Con: Lower GVM
Pro: 3.5t towing capacity

2023 Mahindra Pik-Up S11 4x4 Dual Cab
https://www.carsguide.com.au/mahindra/pik-up/price/2023/s11-4x4?id=zIzNINEM
Pro: Wildcard with a cult following like Grenadier
Pro: Reliable, sturdy vehicle
Pro: Landcruiser for a fraction of the price
Pro: Aisin 6 speed auto
Pro: Apple CarPlay & Android Auto - pretty sure LC78 doesn't have this
Pro: Proper offroader
Con: 2.5t towing capacity
Con: Leaf springs
Con: Mahindra dealer network isn't huge
Con: Interior feels cheap - some of the Chinese utes feel more premium for less money
Con: Ute - I'd prefer a wagon
Con: Not a huge amount of aftermarket accessories out (yet)

So what would be the conclusion? G63?

 

[Thomski]

So what would be the conclusion? G63?

 

[Thomski]

I think this thread must sum up a large amount of of what Australian buyers have considered over the past few years. I personally have been through the same process of evaluation and can’t get past the fact that the grenadier is the best option for me compared to the competition, the main things I wanted from an upgrade to my petrol v8 landcruiser were;
1, 3.5 t towing - dragging a big boat around makes this a must
2, automatic - why Toyota couldn’t make a 78 with an auto baffles me
3. Diesel - towing and torque
4. Genuine off road capability for tracks like csr and holland track
5. Payload
6. Well appointed interior with some mods cons I.e Apple car play
7. Not cost more than $100k ish
I use my car (like most I think) as a daily driver then as a tow vehicle and then as the weapon to take my family into the middle of nowhere with no phone reception.

Nothing else I looked at cut the mustard..